Build A Better Format #1

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Celebi23

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While we can all agree that Pokémon is a pretty good game, it does have its problems. It's fairly easy to win on the first turn, a select group of cards tends to dominate every format, many games come down to who topdecks a Supporter first, many formats end up being triangles where whoever plays the best matchups throughout a tournament has the highest chance of winning, and the list goes on.

In these unique competitions, players will have the opportunity to create fake cards and/or game rulings in an attempt to improve these aspects of the game for competitive players. While these cards obviously will not be released in real Pokémon sets, they may be printed in Back to Basics or used in casual play. More specific rules will be given for each version of the activity.


This time, members will focus on improving the consistency aspect of the game. Many consistency cards, such as Smeargle, also speed up the game significantly and are unreliable.

Similarly, cards like Claydol GE and Pidgeot FL went to the other extreme. While they took a little longer to set up, once in play, they guaranteed the player very effective search/draw for the rest of the game. It was almost impossible to prevent your opponent from drawing what they needed as long as one of those cards remained in play.

However, at the same time, some form of consistency that remains on the field is necessary in order for each player to have an even chance at winning and to prevent the game from coming down to who draws better.

In this activity, players will attempt to create a consistency card that is a Pokémon, but is neither overcentralizing or unreliable. It should be enough to make it so that each player is not reliant on topdecking Supporters to keep a steady stream of drawing going, but at the same time, it shouldn't be so good that makes cards like N (and draw Supporters in general) useless or speeds up/overcentralizes the game.

You may make multiple cards to create an "engine", but you may not make more than 5. Pre-evolutions count!

All participants should work together to create the best idea possible. If time allows, there will be a competition afterward to make the card more specific and refined.

This event will be held every month, with a different topic every time.

Part 1: Concepts & Visualization
For now, we're just brainstorming. Just throw whatever ideas you have out there and others will comment on them. Try not to get too specific! Saying, "Ability Diving Draw - Discard a card from your hand. Then, draw 2 cards." is too specific and doesn't give enough information, but "we need to have an Ability because if it has an attack for consistency, people will be less likely to use it and the cost will be too great. The Ability should allow players to draw cards, but at a price. If it just allows easy draw, it will be too good. The drawback could involve discarding cards."

Please post your ideas in this thread.
 
We should have card. It should be a stage 2 so it is not too easy to get out, but also not too hard. It should have an ability allowing you to draw2-3 cards but at a price. Maybe discarding cards or something along the lines of not being able to attack that turn. Making a usable consistency card but not something you would use every turn.
 
^You mean Empoleon?

Basically I'd just remake Unown R, but with free retreat. Nowadays our format has packed decks, so including an engine like that is both risky, yet rewarding. Without there being too many really easy ways to donk (Machamp and Rampardos) the format won't exactly break down.
 
No, I meant a Stage 1 sorry. And the card should not cause you to end your turn, just make you not be able to attack that turn.
 
I think that there could be a card that allows you to get a few cards of choice from your deck with a drawback such as missing an attack or letting your opponent draw a few cards.
 
iisnumber12 said:
I think that there could be a card that allows you to get a few cards of choice from your deck with a drawback such as missing an attack or letting your opponent draw a few cards.

Ampharos: HP 110 {L}

Ability: Over Drive
Once during your turn (before your attack) you may search your deck for any one card an put it into your hand. Shuffle your deck afterward. If you do, your opponet may draw two cards.

{L} {C} {C} Card Crash 30+
Does +10 damage for each card in your opponet's hand.

W: {F} R:_
Retreat:{C} {C}

Maybe something that could be used in Back to Basics?
 
I like the idea of this thread, players are always complaining the format is unbalanced when even they can't even think of ways to make a balanced game. Balancing games is very difficult.

Two out of the blue here.

Gengar

Ability: Disable

If you have less than three cards in your hand, none of which is a supporter, your opponent can't attack during his/her turn.

Heatmor

Ability: If the defending Pokemon is Durant, take any card from your discard pile and shuffle it back into your deck. This ability cannot be used if Durant is affected by a special condition.

Gengar allows you to stall while you try to top deck a supporter. Heatmor allows you to search for cards Durant might've discarded like Rare Candy or even supporters. They're very stupid cards I thought up for the sake of posting something really.

Just thought of a good one:

Shaymin

Ability: Celebration Wind
Once during your turn, if Shaymin is your active Pokemon, look at the top 7 cards of your deck. Choose a supporter you find there and put it on the top of your deck.
 
I think hand-fixing attacks without other effects would be underpowered on anything but Basic Pokemon, which would lead us back to the ridiculous Cleffa situation at the beginning of this format. When such an attack would have any other major effects, it would have to be on an Evolved Pokemon, where it is not worth the bother of setting up, or if it is playable, overcentralizes the game because it is probably good enough to build a deck around. This deck would obviously become one of the most consistent around. Because of this, it seems clear to me that any solution to this would have to be an ability.

A good consistency-boosting ability on a Basic Pokemon would probably be overpowered. This means we need to make it rather weak, or put it on an Evolved Pokemon. Given how important the luck of drawing your Rare Candies is in setting up a Stage 2 in a format with Catcher, it should probably be a stage 1, or have a Basic form that can somehow search out Candies without being an engine in itself. In my opinion, a Stage 1 strikes the best balance between setup and accessibility.

As for the nature of the ability itself, it should not cause situations where the first can be used to draw into the second to speed things up further. This was one of the biggest issues with Claydol. This can be solved by making the ability unstackable, or simply by adding a "you can only use one *abilityname* each turn" clause. I also think it would be best if the ability did not generate raw card advantage, but it should be good enough to fit in any deck.

To combine all of the above, I would suggest the following:

Stage 1, evolves from *Basic*, 80-100 HP
Ability - Once during your turn, you may search your deck for a Supporter card. Then, shuffle the rest of your deck and put that card on top.

Basic, 40 HP

Attack: [C]: Search your deck for a card that evolves from this Pokemon and put it onto this Pokemon (this counts as evolving this Pokemon). Shuffle your deck afterwards

Other stats/attacks to be determined later.

This guarantees a Supporter every turn, but at the cost of a regular topdeck. This makes it useless when you already have a supporter in hand, but it can save decks from mid-game supporter droughts. Essentially, it doesn't speed decks up, but it prevents them from slowing down. Putting the Stage 1 within OHKO range of most serious decks makes it a vulnerable point in your setup, but this probably won't lead to "kill the engine" situations, because it works one turn ahead. The Basic has an Ascension-type attack, which is powerful on a setup card like this. The forty HP is meant to make it an undesirable start regardless, and giving the Stage 1 a retreat cost of 2 or more could balance this further if necessary.

The only important negative I can think of is making really insane starts more difficult to stop, because it reduces late-game Ns to a mere one-turn speed bump.
 
^ The problem with that is you're dedicating 2+ spots to that pokemon when those spots could be used for more supporters.
 
But Pokemon are more easily searchable than Supporters, and this one sets itself up. Please don't mention Random Receiver now, because that doesn't have any added value over a higher supporter count, except for evading Smeargle, which my suggestion also does.
 
TheBugManiac said:
But Pokemon are more easily searchable than Supporters, and this one sets itself up. Please don't mention Random Receiver now, because that doesn't have any added value over a higher supporter count, except for evading Smeargle, which my suggestion also does.

Deck-thinning + Junk armable.

If using Random Receiver had no benefit over adding more supporters to your list, no competitive list would run it.
 
And surprise surprise, Smearle is the main reason for that. This is not about whether or not RR is superior to a higher supporter count, but if my idea would be playable.

As for the awesome deck thinning, the concentration of Supporter equivalents for N supporter equivalents in a deck of D after playing the supporter equals the following (Smearle not included as a supporter equivalent due to different searching math):

(N over 1)/(D over 1) = N/D for only supporters played
(N-R over 1)/(D-R over 1) = (N-R)/(D-R) for R Random Receivers played.

Obviously, there is no difference in the odds of drawing the first supporter equivalent. Now lets work it out for different game situations:

Early game: N=11 (1 SE played), D=50, R=1

Supporters: 11/50 = .22
RR: 10/49 = .204

RR is detrimental early on.

Mid game: N=8, D=25, R=3
Supporters: 8/25 = .32
RR: 5/22 = .227

It only gets worse mid-game.

Late game: N=5, D=12, R=4
Supporters: 5/12 = .417
RR: 1/8 = .125

Game, set and match for supporters.
This obviously isn‘t entirely fair, so let‘s see what happens if we add 3 to N in the mid- and late-game situations for Junk Arm into RR. If you need to use more than half your Junk Arms for Supporters, you‘re in bad shape anyway, so this should be about realistic:

Early game: N=11, D=50, R=1

Supporters: .22
RR: .204
This obviously doesn‘t change.

Mid game: N=8(+3), D=25, R=3
Supporters: .32
RR: 8/22 = .364
RR has caught up.

Late game: N=5(+3), D=12, R=4
Supporters: .417
RR: 4/8 = .5
And it pulls ahead further in the late game.

However, to get these numbers you have to be willing to burn a Junk Arm at any time for the guaranteed supporter. And, what‘s more, Random Receiver would be strictly worse in a situation without Smeargle or Junk Arm.

And guess what? Smeargle and Junk Arm are two of the cards that make this format unhealthy. Using these as an argument here rather defeats the point of the thread.

By the way, please don‘t accuse me of faulty logic when you are blatantly blowing up my statements first.
 
You're saying the point of this thread is to theorize cards which will make the format healthier. You then proceed to say that Junk Arm and Smeargle are what is making it unhealthy, but you make a point saying your Pokemon bypasses Smeargle, implying that we will only be adding cards, not nerfing or removing cards like Smeargle and Junk Arm.

I'm attacking your point that Random Receiver offers no benefit over running more supporters. I'd be happy to continue the argument over PM, since this may or may not be relevant to the thread, but be that as it may, you respond to my statement with a bunch of statistics regarding your card's advantages. Most top-decking etc. occurs during the late game so your statistics do your points harm, because your card offers no particular advantage over using Random Receiver, which we've already established the current cards will stay.
 
The majority can be wrong. Sanity is not statistical.

If you don‘t want to hear me ramble about RR, don‘t react to a borderline relevant statement about RR.

As for your point concerning Smeargle, that statement was relevant to Supporter searching in general, but in hindsight not very relevant to this thread. I have never intended to presume knowledge about the exact ideas behind this thread, apart from theorizing about format health. If we were to nerf or remove cards, by the way, Junk Arm and Smeargle would probably be among the prime suspects, so I don‘t see the problem there.

Apologies for the inconvenience, let‘s get back on topic:

As another option, a comes-into-play ability might work, though that would have to be way more balanced than Uxie was...
 
TheBugManiac said:
As another option, a comes-into-play ability might work, though that would have to be way more balanced than Uxie was...

Celibi: {P} 70 HP

Ability: Future Sight
Once during your turn (befor eyour attack), when you play this pokemon from your hand to your bench you may look at the top five cards of you deck and put them back in any order.

{P} {C} Damage Placement
Put 30 damage on all of your opponet's pokemon that have Abilities.

W: {P} R: {W}
Retreat: {C}

edit: Edited the Ampharos with it's other stats.
 
True that. His Celebi does have one important thing going for it though: higher HP and a potentially useful attack.
 
We're just talking about in general. Try not to think too much about the other cards in the format when designing this. Think more about what the game could make use of in general.

Also, if we're going to get to the next step, we're going to need people to critique others' ideas and come to some sort of agreement about whose is best, not just throw their own ideas out there (although that helps too).

Oh, and remember that it's okay to have up to five cards! You can use multiple peoples' ideas and make them have synergy, or not have synergy.
 
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