RE: Does Pokémon Need to go Back to Basics?
More to the point, I'll go on. I have not read 100% of the material in this thread (though I have read a fair chunk of it), and I'd like to say the following:
If the people of the past saw what the future was like, they would not have printed Pokemon Collector. They would have reprinted Holon Mentor. Moving on.
The points that have been explained above are probably the roots of the reasons why I do not like playing in tournaments anymore. If you don't own any Terrakion, Zekrom EX, or Mewtwo EX...you don't top cut. You lose, time and time again, simple as that. (Granted, I was playing an odd hybrid meta deck and lost every game that day, but it's got nothing to do with the reason I don't like tournaments - plus I did play three VERY good games that day.)
I actually miss the days of DP-on and MD-on, really. I know there are a lot of whiners out there who don't like Luxchomp and thought it was dominating. It wasn't - not in the slightest. In those days, the player with the most skill AND the most solid list was the winner; there were plenty of opportunities for various deck ideas, and the wide pool of Trainers/Supporters/Stadiums available made for a great amount of variety in deck-building. (I wasn't around during the EX series days, but I have heard that the meta back then was much the same way.)
Here is a bit of an example - a loose one, but still pretty good. For a while back in MD-on, I ran Blastzel with a Kingdra Prime tech; the object as you're probably aware was to hit 100 every turn, BUT that one Kingdra Prime tech turned the Luxchomp matchup substantially in my favor, as it allowed me to OHKO a Luxray or a Garchomp. (I actually won more games against Luxchomp with it than I lost.) Both of those guys had 110 HP for what was effectively a Stage 1. Not bad. But Blastoise, a Stage 2, had 130 HP, plus a much stronger sniping attack than Dragon Rush. ...You get the idea. There was no one concept that was completely overbearing; the meta was rather welcoming and allowed for all sorts of new ideas.
Now let's make an example. To make things a bit less extreme, let us go back to the days of EP, right when Catcher came out. On the one hand, let's say you have Zekrom. It's got a rather impressive 130 HP - on a Basic, no less! - and two impressive attacks; one costs a mere DCE and has base 20, but it powers up the more he's damaged. The second attack costs a few Lightnings or so and does 120 damage, and he does 40 damage to himself. On the other hand, you have Gothitelle. She, like Zekrom, has 130 HP, but she is a Stage 2, and she takes a while to get out - just hope you don't get Catcher'd. Her Ability is amazing - blocks your opponent's Items while she is active, plus an attack that can do 50 (if you want to attack faster) or 90 (if you don't mind waiting). Anyone who has a working knowledge of matchups knows that Zekrom will just utterly destroy Gothitelle.
Why? I leave you to figure that out on your own.
I'll say that the HS-NV metagame was a LOT better than HS-EP. When NV came out, I had very high hopes for where the game was going. It did introduce some interesting new gigantic Basics like Kyurem, but it also introduced quite a few Evolution cards with good attacks - Vanilluxe is one of the most notable - and even better, it had a great selection of trainers available! Rocky Helmet, Eviolite, Super Rod, N...we all use these. At the time, there weren't any decks that were so completely overbearing as to eclipse everything else.
And then we got Mewtwo EX - the card with no true counters except itself. You can probably see where I'm going with this, but if you can't: oh, I won't tell you. You guys have seen the various Mewtwo debates; you can figure this out.
So why are we all ranting? The answer is that this situation does not show any signs of improving. The metagame will continue to be dominated by giant Basics - they will get larger, bigger, and stronger, and the legendary Pokemon will become overbearing. On the other hand...the Evolution cards will stay exactly where they have been. The current highest HP in the format is 180, and of those winners, there is only one card that isn't a basic Pokemon EX - that last slot goes to Wailord, out of virtue that Wailord must always have large amounts of HP. (The problem is that Wailord has terrible attacks - the EXs do not, and they tip the prize exchange heavily in their favor, despite the knockout drawback!)
...I'm going to shut up and get to the point now, since you guys did not want to see me complain all day, but I wanted to say all the above so you could see where I was going. I honestly yearn for the days where you could have fun at a tournament and not have to rely almost exclusively on basics with 130 HP or more - or just say "screw it" and go play Durant (which, contrary to popular opinion, requires a bit more skill to play than you would believe. VVV is like that too, but I digress), trying a different angle of approach. And I know those are very odd (and somewhat-cheap) decks to play, but if I don't want to conform to the rest of the players and run decks that can do well without having to rely on big Basics...then, guys, what choice do I have?
I want to try and make the game fun for myself, and that's why I build the decks I build. Deciding to play meta for CA States was probably the stupidest mistake I've ever made (as evidenced by how much I crashed and burned, whereas playing Victini Donk at AZ States made me go 4-4) - I want to enjoy tournaments. If I just want to win, and go in with the expectation of winning, and try to make a deck for that purpose and that purpose only, some people will win and others will be thoroughly disappointed.
I am all for returning things to the way that they should be. And if PCL and TPCI will listen to us, then please, make it happen. But until a day comes where we don't need to worry about imbalanced cards comes along...I will be utterly disgusted with the tournament scene for at least another 2 years.
Pokemon cares too much about little kids to care about the rest of us - as long as they get their money, they're happy. So if you guys are reading this and you show no intention of changing...you disgust me.
They laughed at me when I suggested the rotation should have been Black/White-on. Who's laughing now?
More to the point, I'll go on. I have not read 100% of the material in this thread (though I have read a fair chunk of it), and I'd like to say the following:
If the people of the past saw what the future was like, they would not have printed Pokemon Collector. They would have reprinted Holon Mentor. Moving on.
The points that have been explained above are probably the roots of the reasons why I do not like playing in tournaments anymore. If you don't own any Terrakion, Zekrom EX, or Mewtwo EX...you don't top cut. You lose, time and time again, simple as that. (Granted, I was playing an odd hybrid meta deck and lost every game that day, but it's got nothing to do with the reason I don't like tournaments - plus I did play three VERY good games that day.)
I actually miss the days of DP-on and MD-on, really. I know there are a lot of whiners out there who don't like Luxchomp and thought it was dominating. It wasn't - not in the slightest. In those days, the player with the most skill AND the most solid list was the winner; there were plenty of opportunities for various deck ideas, and the wide pool of Trainers/Supporters/Stadiums available made for a great amount of variety in deck-building. (I wasn't around during the EX series days, but I have heard that the meta back then was much the same way.)
Here is a bit of an example - a loose one, but still pretty good. For a while back in MD-on, I ran Blastzel with a Kingdra Prime tech; the object as you're probably aware was to hit 100 every turn, BUT that one Kingdra Prime tech turned the Luxchomp matchup substantially in my favor, as it allowed me to OHKO a Luxray or a Garchomp. (I actually won more games against Luxchomp with it than I lost.) Both of those guys had 110 HP for what was effectively a Stage 1. Not bad. But Blastoise, a Stage 2, had 130 HP, plus a much stronger sniping attack than Dragon Rush. ...You get the idea. There was no one concept that was completely overbearing; the meta was rather welcoming and allowed for all sorts of new ideas.
Now let's make an example. To make things a bit less extreme, let us go back to the days of EP, right when Catcher came out. On the one hand, let's say you have Zekrom. It's got a rather impressive 130 HP - on a Basic, no less! - and two impressive attacks; one costs a mere DCE and has base 20, but it powers up the more he's damaged. The second attack costs a few Lightnings or so and does 120 damage, and he does 40 damage to himself. On the other hand, you have Gothitelle. She, like Zekrom, has 130 HP, but she is a Stage 2, and she takes a while to get out - just hope you don't get Catcher'd. Her Ability is amazing - blocks your opponent's Items while she is active, plus an attack that can do 50 (if you want to attack faster) or 90 (if you don't mind waiting). Anyone who has a working knowledge of matchups knows that Zekrom will just utterly destroy Gothitelle.
Why? I leave you to figure that out on your own.
I'll say that the HS-NV metagame was a LOT better than HS-EP. When NV came out, I had very high hopes for where the game was going. It did introduce some interesting new gigantic Basics like Kyurem, but it also introduced quite a few Evolution cards with good attacks - Vanilluxe is one of the most notable - and even better, it had a great selection of trainers available! Rocky Helmet, Eviolite, Super Rod, N...we all use these. At the time, there weren't any decks that were so completely overbearing as to eclipse everything else.
And then we got Mewtwo EX - the card with no true counters except itself. You can probably see where I'm going with this, but if you can't: oh, I won't tell you. You guys have seen the various Mewtwo debates; you can figure this out.
So why are we all ranting? The answer is that this situation does not show any signs of improving. The metagame will continue to be dominated by giant Basics - they will get larger, bigger, and stronger, and the legendary Pokemon will become overbearing. On the other hand...the Evolution cards will stay exactly where they have been. The current highest HP in the format is 180, and of those winners, there is only one card that isn't a basic Pokemon EX - that last slot goes to Wailord, out of virtue that Wailord must always have large amounts of HP. (The problem is that Wailord has terrible attacks - the EXs do not, and they tip the prize exchange heavily in their favor, despite the knockout drawback!)
...I'm going to shut up and get to the point now, since you guys did not want to see me complain all day, but I wanted to say all the above so you could see where I was going. I honestly yearn for the days where you could have fun at a tournament and not have to rely almost exclusively on basics with 130 HP or more - or just say "screw it" and go play Durant (which, contrary to popular opinion, requires a bit more skill to play than you would believe. VVV is like that too, but I digress), trying a different angle of approach. And I know those are very odd (and somewhat-cheap) decks to play, but if I don't want to conform to the rest of the players and run decks that can do well without having to rely on big Basics...then, guys, what choice do I have?
I want to try and make the game fun for myself, and that's why I build the decks I build. Deciding to play meta for CA States was probably the stupidest mistake I've ever made (as evidenced by how much I crashed and burned, whereas playing Victini Donk at AZ States made me go 4-4) - I want to enjoy tournaments. If I just want to win, and go in with the expectation of winning, and try to make a deck for that purpose and that purpose only, some people will win and others will be thoroughly disappointed.
I am all for returning things to the way that they should be. And if PCL and TPCI will listen to us, then please, make it happen. But until a day comes where we don't need to worry about imbalanced cards comes along...I will be utterly disgusted with the tournament scene for at least another 2 years.
Pokemon cares too much about little kids to care about the rest of us - as long as they get their money, they're happy. So if you guys are reading this and you show no intention of changing...you disgust me.
