Finished Mafia LI: Senate Subterfuge~Game Over!

Status
Not open for further replies.
PMJ said:
Considering we have two more days at best, if any confirmed townies are hiding, now is the time to come out.
Click to expand...

Wether PMJ is loyalist or not, this is true. Like it or not scattered mind, but I have a hard time believing this claim if you refuse to reveal your mason and if no one comes foreward to save you. The situation requires it, don't be stubborn.

Where is your case scattered mind? This is omgus. Here is a lesson: try harder, show us proof or alternatives. PMJ can't be the whole scum team.
 
Can you give me a reason why I need to out my partner ? If my partner would be targeted he can claim for himself. There is no need to do that. It’s to put a big marker on him telling the scum to kill him. Again this is different from just claiming “I am the doctor “ we are talking about a host confirmed role that confirms that there are 2 townies in a chat together. I claimed to be one of them. Scum can do that but it would be stupid because all the real townie needs to do is to counter claim and then after he dies the one who lies is a confirmed scum. I just don’t understand why I even need to explain that. It’s common knowledge.
 
Yeah, it's so hard to believe that when you are pegged as hard scum, no one believes you when you claim to be confirmed town and don't reveal the name of the one person who could back up your claim. It's a real mystery why you are still getting votes.
 
I could do that easily but I’d rather town would have a simple deduction skill to figure it out without painting a target on my partner for the scum.
 
So what you're saying is that you're town, but deliberately withholding crucial information that would not only save your life but provide new insight into everyone else, because the town isn't playing how you want them to.

Can we please lynch this scum already?
 
Post the name of your partner and all your reads.
 
scattered mind said:
Can you give me a reason why I need to out my partner ? If my partner would be targeted he can claim for himself. There is no need to do that. It’s to put a big marker on him telling the scum to kill him. Again this is different from just claiming “I am the doctor “ we are talking about a host confirmed role that confirms that there are 2 townies in a chat together. I claimed to be one of them. Scum can do that but it would be stupid because all the real townie needs to do is to counter claim and then after he dies the one who lies is a confirmed scum. I just don’t understand why I even need to explain that. It’s common knowledge.
Click to expand...

Stop stalling, there are a few reasons:

  • At this stage of the game having two confirmed townies is immensely helpful, it will improve our reads. Regardless of the outing, scum will likely hit a town tonight, at most there's one more indie. Besides it's not like we're giving away a doctor or a cop. That is what scum is after in the first place, not masons that lack active abilities.
  • We would know for certain that this is not a scum tactic. Yes, it's possible to lie about being in a mason chat. If you know that there's something preventing the other player(s) from revealing their inclusion. This could be a rule imposed on the quick topic. Or simply achieved by silencing a player.
I agree that it would be a risky short term tactic, but your refusal to cooperate doesn't look good on you.
 
I'm sorry, I was wrong. I take back everything I said; you guys are cleared now. Thanks for coming forward!

Just kidding.

Do you know how I knew you'd pick Mariano? Because he was the only person you could have possibly chosen, everyone else would have called bullshit.

The real reason the masons haven't come forward is simple - they're not allowed to disclose they were in the basement chat. That's why it has its own set of rules, that's why they didn't come forward the second Tapu Lele got outed - hell, even if they knew there was a scum in their midst by the basement chat rules, they still could not disclose it to the town. We already had an innocent child; what makes you think the hosts - who have done their damnedest to avoid scum hunting based on night actions alone - would allow two masons to confirm each other to the town? Three confirmed innocents? Get real :D

This is a gambit, nothing more, a realization that you could claim masons knowing that the real ones couldn't counterclaim you.

There's no way you're town. If you flip town I'll lead my own lynch tomorrow.
 
PMJ said:
I'm sorry, I was wrong. I take back everything I said; you guys are cleared now. Thanks for coming forward!

Just kidding.

Do you know how I knew you'd pick Mariano? Because he was the only person you could have possibly chosen, everyone else would have called bullshit.

The real reason the masons haven't come forward is simple - they're not allowed to disclose they were in the basement chat. That's why it has its own set of rules, that's why they didn't come forward the second Tapu Lele got outed - hell, even if they knew there was a scum in their midst by the basement chat rules, they still could not disclose it to the town. We already had an innocent child; what makes you think the hosts - who have done their damnedest to avoid scum hunting based on night actions alone - would allow two masons to confirm each other to the town? Three confirmed innocents? Get real :D

This is a gambit, nothing more, a realization that you could claim masons knowing that the real ones couldn't counterclaim you.

There's no way you're town. If you flip town I'll lead my own lynch tomorrow.
Click to expand...

This point I agree the most with seeing how host always said this game don't work well with just normal gameplay. The game will be beyond broken if they can easily be cleared as town with the simple way of claiming. I refuse to believe only dos roles kept the claim in check.
 
Welcome to the Curia Basement!
As you all know, in this basement, one of you is aligned with the Triumvirate while the other two are working with the Loyalists. How will this work, you ask? Good question!
All of you have been given anonymous accounts to post in this chat with. This is for a reason. Do not claim or hint at your identity in here. You can discuss anything else (as long as you stay in site and game rules; this means no editing or deleting posts), however, which you may find helpful.
At the end of Night 3, the two Loyalists will send us who they think is the Triumvirate member. If they are both right, they will kill the Triumvirate member and have access to this chat as a masonry. If they fail, the Triumvirate member will get to join the scumchat and this chat will be locked.
As you are all in the basement, you cannot be killed until Night 3, when your stay here ends. Until then, however, you are all safe from the nightkill (though not from the lynch or from other killing abilities), so rejoice!
Until the end of Night 3, do not claim or hint at having this ability in-thread in any way.
Click to expand...

Prepare to lead your own lynch, PMJ.
 
PMJ said:
Just kidding.

Do you know how I knew you'd pick Mariano? Because he was the only person you could have possibly chosen, everyone else would have called bullshit.

The real reason the masons haven't come forward is simple - they're not allowed to disclose they were in the basement chat. That's why it has its own set of rules, that's why they didn't come forward the second Tapu Lele got outed - hell, even if they knew there was a scum in their midst by the basement chat rules, they still could not disclose it to the town. We already had an innocent child; what makes you think the hosts - who have done their damnedest to avoid scum hunting based on night actions alone - would allow two masons to confirm each other to the town? Three confirmed innocents? Get real :D

This is a gambit, nothing more, a realization that you could claim masons knowing that the real ones couldn't counterclaim you.

There's no way you're town. If you flip town I'll lead my own lynch tomorrow.
Click to expand...

They could just vote scattered though...
 
mirdo said:
Right. This is interessting. Not only did TE have a retaliation ability the second time in a row. But he hit big time with it for a second time in a row.

So. Good is. We know who scum is. We know who we can't trust. But one thing that makes me questioning pushing a lynch is his ability.
That states that he is stuck in somesort of basement?
Does that mean anything for us in means of gameplay?

Is he bulletproof? (Until he lets "get out")
Can he not be checked on in nightphases? (Until he let's "get out"?)
Does he not have communication with the rest of the scum team yet?

Am I reading to much into this?

Maybe.
But probably not tbh.
Click to expand...

This is a post from Mirdo who subbed out and was replaced by Mariano. It is right after Tapu Lele's reveal. Notice how he speculated very specifically about Tapu Lele might being bulletproof despite no link to it. This is because he was confused about the basement mechanic that tells that all 3 of us cannot die but he misread the part it says that it is only from night kills, not lynches.
 
I don't get this setup at all.

##unvote
##vote mordacazir

So we're back to this then. Lynching mord can give us another clear, if he's scum with the chat ability. Otherwise I might just wanna see Jabberwock lynched out of spite.

If mord is town, then I honestly have no idea. Nick, Robin, and Yog all allegedly have some sort of protection ability; one or more of them has gotta be lying. My guess would be Yog; he offered up "hey guys the scum attacked me" after I said how dumb it was that Nick did the exact same thing and that gave him town credit in my eyes. Could be looking for that same town credit since I currently read him as scummy, and he reads me as town so he would value a town rating from me.
 
PMJ said:
My guess would be Yog; he offered up "hey guys the scum attacked me" after I said how dumb it was that Nick did the exact same thing and that gave him town credit in my eyes. Could be looking for that same town credit since I currently read him as scummy, and he reads me as town so he would value a town rating from me.
Click to expand...

Can you clarify who's he in this part? Didn't understand.
 
Yog
 
I'm going to take a look at every case so far (slowly but surely) and see if it really is beeter than lynching PMJ:

Morda:

Jabberwock said:
Interesting you say that.




Townreading scattered, Cel, Yog to an extent. Leaning town on you just because I'm leaning scum on bb and I don't see this being orchestrated.


A'ight let's see what claiming actually does in this game. I am in a neighbor chat with mord (and nobody else). Here's a list of all his relevant posts from it:










(at this point I told him "Even if I'm scum there's nothing I can do to you if you tell me what you've got.")


(several IRL days pass)




TL;DR, mord was fishing hard, gave up for a while, then got reminded to do so by his scumchat. He continually asked for reads and whatnot without offering any of his own. He's one of my top scumreads atm, and given bb's defense of him it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if they were buddies.
Click to expand...

This is just WIFOM - you are looking at this and you can have both ways - asking for your reads without sharing your own is not scummy. You do that all the time in thread. When I ask someone about what he thinks about another player, I don't think about giving my own opinion unless I really want to. Not because I feel that if I don't do that it will be considered scummy.
What is that even? A new term? Readfishing? nope, I don't see how it can be a valid scumtell.

Robin Aisaga said:
I'm still in dubio about Jplap, he could also just be a player who doesn't pay attention. Mord is a good candidate with leads however. Jabberwock has pointed out several things from their QuickTopic that raise questions.

  • Claiming to have a lead on BBninjas but doesn't present it when asked for
  • Comments that do not match with in thread comments (I don't trust anyone / Hey I'm town I think you're town!)
  • Possible fishing for information

Also Yog has had their vote on Mord since yesterday, but I guess that doesn't say a lot.

##VOTE: Mordacazir
Click to expand...

1. there are lots of reasons for not presenting your whole cards. Maybe he wanted to see if Jabber will be extra curious about it and start role fishing, maybe he thought Jabber can give him insights that would help whatever he got on bb. Maybe he just doesn't trust Jabber enough and told him he trusts him just so Jabber won't be afraid to rolefish hard in case he is scum.
2. See above. Also, it is a premise in this game not to trust anyone, and yet have the ability to town read people. It is a contradictive startegy, but that just how you need to play as town. You need to be suspicious of everyone, but you still need to deduct who's more likely to be scum and who's less. Anyway, as a point, it does not warrent a lynch.
3. Again, information is a big word. In Mafia it kinds split to two- roles and reads. Roles is the information you must hide from scum. Your reads however.. are not. You can't advance in the game unless you ask for people's opinion. In contrast, you absolutely don't need to rolefish in order to advance in the game unless you are scum (or have a really good reason).

So yeah, no idea why the case on mord got so popular.

PMJ meanwhile has the whole thing with bbninjas which was covered already on how it is so weird and very possibly scumvsscum. That case can be reread. it was brought by Celever (dead town). Also, may I add that this tactic which is so risky is also very fitting for PMJ- he did a similar risky move in another game where he blocked his own kill using his scumbuddy which was a scum doctor. Also, him targeting me still after I claimed to be in the basement- a host confirmed townie role- is a glaring and alarming point. PMJ should know that there was no need for me to out my partner- but he still insisted and pushed me to do that - "the only thing that will save you" - yet, when I said "ok here you go, it is unnecessary but whatever- it's Mariano" - he still pushed for my lynch. This is absurd and just confirms that all he wanted was to know who else was in the basement. Some people asked why stalling the reveal of a confirmed town- this is very useful guys. Scum should know this too, that if there is a potential confirmed town - he can ruin their plans during late game. He can pop out at any moment, clear himself and just like that, leave no other player for the scum team to manipulate the town to lunch instead of them. Detecting the confirmed scums and kill them soon is a top priority for scums- that's why they immediately killed dos. You just don't leave a confirmed town alive-never. So imagine the situation after the role flip of Tapu Lele- revealing that there are two players who can at any time claim and get confirmed town. An extremely dangerous condition for the scum team.

I'll look at Yog next.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top