Finished Werewolf XIX: Mafia Wins

[Celever]

Sure, vanilla isn't the most fun in the world, but they are very important for balance purposes. It's either going to be vanilla or something like a BPV, one-shot hook or some useless role which gives the player an illusion of power. If you don't like playing as vanilla then don't play werewolf.

Also, just want to point this out, but pokebeach is literally the only place on the internet where role madness games exist, as far as I can see anyway. People rarely, RARELY complain about vanillas existing on other sites. It's just because you have the alternative on this site, but generally speaking it also puts a more heavy reliance on the power roles to play well, which makes the games much more interesting, especially for the hosts...

But this was an OC game. OC = role madness 100% of the time. Vanilla in OC is not fun and honestly I don't know what you were thinking of when you put them in. I'm sorry, but more than 1 vanilla in an OC is the dumbest thing I've ever heard, because no matter how powerful the role is, duplicates of a role is a duplicate, and in OC... Well they shouldn't exist. Clashing claims always provokes a lynch in an OC game save for inspects etc. because they are rare and if they exist then it should always be specified in the game description. Also not letting you talk at night was stupid, because that is usually the most active time for team mates to talk to eachother. Day is usually for negotiating with others teams, night is for talking with your own and sometimes coordinating kills with other teams.

 

[Camoclone]

VT's are required in OC games especially because without them the town has an extreme advantage. A PR that can post results without claiming is just too powerful (PR sends results to a confo-townie). I kind of zoned out when you started saying duplicates of a role. It's not like a VT would counter claim another VT . Everything we did in this game was carefully planned and was not "stupid" (at least in my opinion). Talking at night doesn't match the flavor and would also make town too powerful.

 

[Celever]

VT's are required in OC games especially because without them the town has an extreme advantage. A PR that can post results without claiming is just too powerful (PR sends results to a confo-townie). I kind of zoned out when you started saying duplicates of a role. It's not like a VT would counter claim another VT . Everything we did in this game was carefully planned and was not "stupid" (at least in my opinion). Talking at night doesn't match the flavor and would also make town too powerful.

That is true. In 1v1. The balance between 1v1 and 2v1 is very different, and I'm not too sure you understand it. In 2v1 the village has two factions gunning for it. In a game of 24 it would have 4 members per team plus the neutral, and both mafia teams would have a hooker and a bodyguard. That's the basics. The village would have some public claims for a villy leader, who would collect claims and then cast lynches on those with duplicate claims. Vanillas offer no assistance and often actually get lynched. Vanillas are so easy to claim in OC that usually they're not even claimed if you were VT and you come up with something different, because they are almost never included. I'm sorry for using the word stupid as it is late, but in my opinion this game could have been balanced much better than just throwing a bunch of vanillas onto the village, especially for what is, I think, quie a lot of these guy's first OC game. Or semi-OC. Because you couldn't talk at night.

 

[Camoclone]

VT's are required in OC games especially because without them the town has an extreme advantage. A PR that can post results without claiming is just too powerful (PR sends results to a confo-townie). I kind of zoned out when you started saying duplicates of a role. It's not like a VT would counter claim another VT . Everything we did in this game was carefully planned and was not "stupid" (at least in my opinion). Talking at night doesn't match the flavor and would also make town too powerful.

That is true. In 1v1. The balance between 1v1 and 2v1 is very different, and I'm not too sure you understand it. In 2v1 the village has two factions gunning for it. In a game of 24 it would have 4 members per team plus the neutral, and both mafia teams would have a hooker and a bodyguard. That's the basics. The village would have some public claims for a villy leader, who would collect claims and then cast lynches on those with duplicate claims. Vanillas offer no assistance and often actually get lynched. Vanillas are so easy to claim in OC that usually they're not even claimed if you were VT and you come up with something different, because they are almost never included. I'm sorry for using the word stupid as it is late, but in my opinion this game could have been balanced much better than just throwing a bunch of vanillas onto the village, especially for what is, I think, quie a lot of these guy's first OC game. Or semi-OC. Because you couldn't talk at night.

You must remember that one group didn't have a night kill though . 7 is really a reasonable number of non-town aligned players in a game with 25 players. In fact I feel that town still had the advantage in this game. The scenario you described is just one way to play an OC game. I've played in my fair share of them and I've only used that strategy once (due to there being VT's in them). VT's are just a way to balance the game.

 

[Celever]

That is true. In 1v1. The balance between 1v1 and 2v1 is very different, and I'm not too sure you understand it. In 2v1 the village has two factions gunning for it. In a game of 24 it would have 4 members per team plus the neutral, and both mafia teams would have a hooker and a bodyguard. That's the basics. The village would have some public claims for a villy leader, who would collect claims and then cast lynches on those with duplicate claims. Vanillas offer no assistance and often actually get lynched. Vanillas are so easy to claim in OC that usually they're not even claimed if you were VT and you come up with something different, because they are almost never included. I'm sorry for using the word stupid as it is late, but in my opinion this game could have been balanced much better than just throwing a bunch of vanillas onto the village, especially for what is, I think, quie a lot of these guy's first OC game. Or semi-OC. Because you couldn't talk at night.

You must remember that one group didn't have a night kill though . 7 is really a reasonable number of non-town aligned players in a game with 25 players. In fact I feel that town still had the advantage in this game. The scenario you described is just one way to play an OC game. I've played in my fair share of them and I've only used that strategy once (due to there being VT's in them). VT's are just a way to balance the game.

Well that runs into whole new, probably worse problems. Harmless factions should always have unique wincons. What if the neutral died early? 7 isn't bad, but 9 would have probably been better. In fact, with the harmless faction you should have had an indie couple and brought it up to 10, as the mafia don't out themselves unless it's anon, generally. VTs do what you just described. They throw off any chance of village leadership, which I think I mentioned in my first post, idr. They throw the whole flow of the game off though... They are just kinda "there" later on in the game and they don't do anything. Like they take part in lynches and stuff, but when the town have a promised victory usually the VTs are the one who throw it by becoming inactive. They are always the most subbed role, and that's because in OC it doesn't balance it, so the VT feels annoyed that they got stuck with a useless role for no reason most of the time.

 

[Camoclone]

You must remember that one group didn't have a night kill though . 7 is really a reasonable number of non-town aligned players in a game with 25 players. In fact I feel that town still had the advantage in this game. The scenario you described is just one way to play an OC game. I've played in my fair share of them and I've only used that strategy once (due to there being VT's in them). VT's are just a way to balance the game.

Well that runs into whole new, probably worse problems. Harmless factions should always have unique wincons. What if the neutral died early? 7 isn't bad, but 9 would have probably been better. In fact, with the harmless faction you should have had an indie couple and brought it up to 10, as the mafia don't out themselves unless it's anon, generally. VTs do what you just described. They throw off any chance of village leadership, which I think I mentioned in my first post, idr. They throw the whole flow of the game off though... They are just kinda "there" later on in the game and they don't do anything. Like they take part in lynches and stuff, but when the town have a promised victory usually the VTs are the one who throw it by becoming inactive. They are always the most subbed role, and that's because in OC it doesn't balance it, so the VT feels annoyed that they got stuck with a useless role for no reason most of the time.

This is where anti-town town roles came in (such as the naive cop). That's why there was so many VT's . I really enjoy having intelligent discussions with players but I don't think we are making any progress (I won't budge and I doubt you will either lol).

 

[Teal]

I play WW on PokéBeach because PB games used to be fun role madness games. If I wanted to play boring, uncreative crappy vanilla games I would go play somewhere else. That vanilla roles are needed for a somewhat balanced game is a huge lie and I will be happy to prove you wrong when I have time to host a game.

Hey there is no reason to keep on bashing our game. If you don't like it then you don't have to signup.

Hosting such a game is away from me as there won't be a good game running instead of it.

I think you can see yourself that it didn't work so what's the point in defending it honestly? Even such a bad game (balance wise) as Dusty Gulch was much more interesting => fun to play until the game ended and it was revealed how ridiculously OP the town was (mainly because the cop was in a waaay too good three mason group and they could singlehandedly win the game for the town... which they pretty much did).

Having an activatable (not passive) role means, that you must pay much more attention to the game so you can make the best possible choice - even if it is a mostly harmless role. It also gives you motivation to gather information in the game. If you do not have a role, you can't use the information gathered during the day as much and it makes it less rewarding to dig for stuff. Especially knowing that there isn't much to dig for. Roleflavour and creative roles are what really make a game here. If you just want to play meta, then you can very well do it somewhere where it works. It has been proven now several times that it doesn't work here, so PLEASE stop forcing it on Pokébeach.

 

[Camoclone]

I play WW on PokéBeach because PokéBeach games used to be fun role madness games. If I wanted to play boring, uncreative crappy vanilla games I would go play somewhere else. That vanilla roles are needed for a somewhat balanced game is a huge lie and I will be happy to prove you wrong when I have time to host a game.

Hey there is no reason to keep on bashing our game. If you don't like it then you don't have to signup.

Hosting such a game is away from me as there won't be a good game running instead of it.

I think you can see yourself that it didn't work so what's the point in defending it honestly? Even such a bad game (balance wise) as Dusty Gulch was much more interesting => fun to play until the game ended and it was revealed how ridiculously OP the town was (mainly because the cop was in a waaay too good three mason group and they could singlehandedly win the game for the town... which they pretty much did).

Having an activatable (not passive) role means, that you must pay much more attention to the game so you can make the best possible choice - even if it is a mostly harmless role. It also gives you motivation to gather information in the game. If you do not have a role, you can't use the information gathered during the day as much and it makes it less rewarding to dig for stuff. Especially knowing that there isn't much to dig for. Roleflavour and creative roles are what really make a game here. If you just want to play meta, then you can very well do it somewhere where it works. It has been proven now several times that it doesn't work here, so PLEASE stop forcing it on Pokébeach.

I PM'd you on purpose. Please continue this conversation in PM. CB and other hosts work hard to make games like this so players like you and I can enjoy them. There is no reason to outright bash the game.

 

[Teal]

I just wanted to show my reasoning in public because some people (you => probably other people) don't seem to understand it. Why am I not allowed to criticize? :/

 

[Kecleon-X]

Teal. Chill pill, bro.

It's alright to constructively criticize, but you were coming off as rather insulting. I know you didn't mean it that way, but either way, I think it is in your best interests to drop it. I mean, remember what you were banned for?

 

[Athena]

This is the point where I step in and be all official and such. There is no problem with criticism so long as it can be done constructively. I do believe that constructive criticism is good for GMs so they will learn to improve their games the next time they run them, but there's no need to bash something overly much. Please keep this in mind and avoid negativity for the sake of negativity.

That said, I must admit that, from a game design/fun point of view, I'm actually with Teal on this one. I haven't played any WW games here, but I'm very active in them on my other forum. With that in mind, I can't comment specifically on this game or other games here, but I can talk about other games that I have played in and run. Most of the games we play are what we call "chocolate" games, which means that every person has a non-vanilla role. We also have "swirl" games that have vanilla roles, but it's also not uncommon for these games to have items and other mechanics to allow even vanilla-roled players to have a bit more fun with the game. The more you can get people involved in a game, the more likely they are to participate and contribute to discussion, making a livelier game for everyone involved.

Also, how many roles or not shouldn't really matter for balance. I myself have GMed a good number of chocolate games with no problems. You can make a completely imbalanced vanilla or swirl game and an awesomely balanced game where everyone has a role. I would personally rather play in a slightly-unbalanced game fulla roles than be vanilla in a perfectly balanced game.

 

[Celever]

Another thing which has to be noted is that for first time or less experienced hosts running a swirl/vanilla game is probably the best route you can go. The more roles the more likely it is that you'll make a mistake. That said, I also agree that all (read: ALL) vanilla games should have something to keep the game more interesting for vanillas, such as items or a HP system, or something completely different. For example, in a couple of other games O've played it uses "Prisoner's Dilemma" from idk a video game somewhere, which boosts and lowers your HP. This makes all vanillas have a purpose when it comes to the prisoner's dilemma phases.

 

[PMJ]

I plan on using vts in ww21 so any way to make things more fun will be appreciated.

 

[Teal]

Not make them vanilla. As I said, vanillas are not required for balance, if such a thing even exists. For example, sometimes a cop might be killed on the first day or night. That throws "your precious balance" off right from the start. WW is much a game of luck. At least make it a fun game of luck. And it's not just luck, of course, but it's a part and you can't take it away. So people should just aim to make it as fun as possible and thus get the players as involved as possible. Vanilla roles don't add to that.

 

[Athena]

I actually dislike pure "cop" roles specifically because they're so hard to balance. There are other power roles the town/inno can have that can be just as good for potentially finding mafia/werewolves/whatever-bad-guys but also easier to balance and require a bit more thought, discussion, and work ideally such as watchers, trackers, roleblockers, role seers, redirectors, etc.

 

[Camoclone]

I plan on using vts in ww21 so any way to make things more fun will be appreciated.

Items / unlockable abilities come to mind. I honestly don't mind being a VT though.

 

[TwistedTurtwig]

I plan on using vts in ww21 so any way to make things more fun will be appreciated.

An announcer. Those always make a game interesting. Multiple announcers make it even better... heh heh heh...

 

[PMJ]

By definition, any vanilla town who has a night action isn't vanilla.

http://www.pokebeach.com/forums/thread-mafia-discussion-thread?pid=2618620#pid2618620 Let's get some mileage out of this thread please.

 

[Celever]

That said, I also agree that all (read: ALL) vanilla games should have something to keep the game more interesting for vanillas, such as items or a HP system, or something completely different.

Tbh, the more novel the better. The most common are items or HP (VTs getting items still count them as vanilla, as long as said item can be passed on/stolen imo) but there is an unlimited amount of possibility, really.

 

[corn bread]

Here are player evaluations:

Spoiler

Machamp The Champion:After Mapleboy’s quick lynch. It was up to Machamp The Champion and TwistedTurtwig to makedo while short a member. Machamp in particular was very active and posted frequently to try and keep the town guessing cold. In his last day alive he really lucked out, because when he got found by Keeper of Night(the real seer) he still managed to cause some chaos because Goodra(the naive seer) had inspected him as well. So in the end although he got found out by the seer he still managed to take down another townie with him. The mafia MVP

Haunted Water- He played decently as a townie at first, although later he slumped into an inactive period which led to him being modkilled.

MtheW- Poor MtheW was inactive in the later part of his game because he thought he was dead. He thought this because of the awkward wording on his role PM. Unfortunately when I cleared this up for him later on he only had 2 days left to live before he died. Sorry MtheW, that one is on me.

sillykyle- The inactive neighborizer, not much comes to mind when I think of sillykyle’s role in this game.

Keeper of Night- An alright seer that was held back by inactive teammates. Keeper of Night survived to the end and ultimately lynched The Necromancer and a mafia member. Even though he did pilot Goodra’s lynch(after a hard fought PM battle btw) I feel as if Keeper of Night could have carried a more active town to victory. The town MVP and overall MVP.

RaichuGirl-One of the members of the Illuminati, the independent group. The Illuminati played alright, but was a tad inactive near the end of the game. RaichuGirl in particular was active enough in trying to seem town, but got done in by GM DracLord on night 4. Leaving the Illuminati without their doctor.

WanderingWolf-The scummiest vanilla townie ever. WanderingWolf got lynched on the 2nd day for a very odd reason, and as such didn’t have much of an impact on the game.

SMP-I personally think that SMP played really well, unfortunately SMP played really well only when SMP was active. SMP’s inactivity(as well as a few others) ended up being the town’s downfall.

GM DracLord- I know that some people believe that GM DracLord should have been modkilled for inactivity, but he was fairly active in sending in night actions. Therefor I kept him alive. I am surprised no one tried to kill GM even after they claimed to be a Jack of all Trades. As the Jack of all Trades GM was either lucky or super-skillful, for he shot dead one of the independents on night 4. As a townie GM played moderately well.

TwistedTurtwig-The lone survivor, TwistedTurtwig gets my vote for luckiest player. If it wasn’t for the inactive town or the fact that Celever got lynched over TT in basically a 50/50 chance, the mafia probably wouldn’t have won. And by the way, TwistedTurtwig was part of the reason the game seemed so inactive, for he killed anyone who would talk later on, leaving the inactive-active ratio to increase towards inactives.

rev3rsor-I liked rev3rsor simply for the fact that rev3rsor wasn't terribly inactive. As a townie rev3rsor played decently.

PMJ-Requested replacement on the first night, was decent for the 1 day they actually were in the game i guess.

Reinforce- PMJ’s replacement. Reinforce was really inactive and only sent in one journal entry for his role.

grantm1999- I thought grantm1999 played pretty well,although I have no idea why grant claimed to be the killer of RaichuGirl. That lie got grant lynched.

Mapleboy86-I don’t even know with this one. Was it luck? Was it bad posting habits? Or was it that people simply don’t like Mapleboy86? I don’t know, but somehow the town lynched a mafia member on the very first day. Sorry Maple.

Teal-Teal played in the fashion of a backwards letter J. Starting out playing actively and really well, but slowly declining in activity, and then when it starts to pick back up again Teal gets killed by TwistedTurtwig.

One Approved- Played ok and really like their role as the necromancer. Unfortunately though One Approved had to request a replacement for reasons unknown to me.

Alex- I don’t think Alex ever knew that it was subbed into the game.

Celever-MVP among those people who subbed into being the necromancer(if that’s a thing). Celever played more secretly, not using the offensive capabilities of their role.Celever did give the game some much needed activity near the end though, and for that we thank you.

Rock Wrecker and Astra-First of all, Rock Wreck was the only one who really did anything with this role. Astra was too inactive which is funny, because a smart doublevoter could be really powerful at the late stages Astra made it to.

TheGuy- The Illuminati’s star player. TheGuy played really well on two fronts, acting town and trying to get the mafia lynched, and checking the roles of people each night to give information to his partners. The 3rd party MVP.

Shiny Goodra- Oh Goodra, if only you knew you were naive. Still though, no breaking the rules .

Poseidon- Played in a way that can best be described with this shape \. Got modkilled for inactivity.

HypnoticChairman-Hypnotic played pretty well and possibly could have gotten an MVP award if it didn’t die so soon compared to the other candidates.

Puff-Sun and Fangarde-Played average. Got modkilled for inactivity. Join the club you two.

Keckleon-X- I want to thank Keckleon-X for being active enough in this game, even after saying that they were too busy and wanted to be a sub at first. Of course though, that activity declined and Keckleon’s modkill probably lost the game at the end for the town.

Drohn-Played pretty well for their first Mafia game. Tried to lead the town after being cleared and didn’t really do anything bad.

And here is my original setup for the game that was meant to be role madness with 25 players.

Spoiler

1.)You are a powerful necromancer,the art has been passed through your family for generations.You mainly used your abilities for defense and entertainment,but now with the world in chaos with wars,rises in crime,and even secret conspiracies and corporations.You believe that it’s time to use your powers to their fullest and bring this world to rights by any means necessary.But first you need recruits,and what better place to get them then the town you grew up in?Probably anyplace is better than the town you grew up closest to, Washington D.C. And now with the war going on, there should be more bodies than ever.

Night ability-Conscription
Each night you may PM me the name of a player that is dead,that player will be resurrected into a zombie under your control.

Night ability-Lord of the flies
When you resurrect a player into a zombie you will induct them into your army.When you have multiple zombies in your army you can send any number of them on special missions.A zombie can only do 1 mission a night
Missions:Infect a player,that player will die at the end of the next night phase and turn into a zombie at the end of the night phase after that one,takes 3 zombies
Scare someone,the sight of one of your squads will drive even the most mentally tough insane,making them run around visiting random people rather than doing what they should,takes 3 zombies
Protect you,zombies aren't very smart,but they are good meat shields,so if you were to be killed the zombies you picked would die for you instead,takes 3 zombies.You can only use this once a night.
Terrorize the town,let your forces loose during the day,causing a rampage and the next day phase to be 3 days shorter,doing this will reveal the existence of a necromancer,takes 5 zombies.
Attack during the night,unleashes your army during the night when you give the command,and any night roles activated after(not before) this command are nullified(there are zombies EVERYWHERE),takes 8 zombies.
You can do as many missions as many times as you want each night,you just need to have the numbers to do them.

Win condition:Survive to be one of the last players alive.

2.)You are....well you don’t really know,you see you were an army veteran who fought in the gulf war.But while serving you were captured for about two weeks,or at least that’s what people say.You don’t remember being captured,in fact you don’t remember much at all before you joined the army.What happened?You just can’t remember.

Night ability-?
You came to DC as you desperately seek answers.So you go around the town questioning people.Atleast one person in the city must have answers.There has to be someone who knows.If you find a person that knows,something special could happen.Each night you may target a player with this ability, you will question them.

Attribute-Shaky morales
If you target any anti-town players with your first ability you have a 50% chance of killing them.

Win condition:Town wins
Role 2.) is a turncoat, joins Illuminati if he targets a member of their faction.
New win condition:illuminati wins
Here are your new abilities:
Masonry-Illuminati
You may communicate with your fellow illuminati members outside of the game via PM.The names of the other masons will be sent to you in another PM.

Night ability-2nd amendment
Now that you are no longer bound by your country's common law, you can put all those old military weapons to use,time for some gunrunning.Each night you may PM me the name of a player NOT in the illuminati.That player will receive a gun which gives them a one time use night kill ability.You have the choice of either notifying them that you gave them the gun,someone else did,or leave it anonymous.You also have the choice of leaving a note telling them who to shoot.

Attribute-rEvolution
You have lots of free time now,time that you spend contributing to the cause. What you do is follow those that the Illuminati has hacked into, and anything they learn, you do too.
3.)You are one of the city's doctor.You have made a vow to protect and save innocent lives from death at the hands of criminals.No matter what the cost.

Night ability-Socratic Oath
Each night you may PM me the name of a player,that player will be protected from death for 1 night.You cannot protect yourself.

Win condition:Town wins
4.)You are a townie that is commonly hated by everyone for being ‘violent’ and owning what is probably the most firearms in town.But despite your peers’ views you believe that some violence will one day save the town,one day....

Attribute-Hated
It takes one less vote to lynch you.

Special ability-Crackshot
Once per game you may PM me the name of a player at any time,that player will be killed.If you do this however, it will be revealed to everyone that you did this.

Win condition:Town wins

5.)You are the sheriff of the city and have served for over 20 years in law enforcement.But sadly, ever since the so called coalition has started their crime spree everyone has gone crazy,even some of your fellow cops.But that doesn’t mean ol Johnny laws giving up,no siree you and whatever's left of the precinct will do all you can to take down the coalition within your boundaries.

Night ability-Criminal record
Every night you may PM me the name of a player,you will use the tools you have left to find out if that player is a mafia member or not.
Win condition:Town wins
6.)You are James Chalon,a big name celebrity with a dark secret,you have ties to all the major criminals of the US and are a leader of the Sicilian Mafia.And boy are you involved with them,you help fund them,and secretly help them communicate and recruit new members using your music and influence.In fact you created and are in charge of the whole mafia coaliton and lead the gang leaders,which makes you responsible for the attack on DC and the outbreak of war in the country.You plan to murder all the major politicions for once the president and all his officials are out of the way the combined power of you and the coalition will bring whats left of the country down to its knees and you can become the most powerful man in the country. North America’s first official Monarch,King James Chalon.

Masonry-Mafia
You are a member of the mafia, so you can communicate with your fellow mafia members(whose names will be sent to you in another PM)outside the game in the coalition hideout subforum about anything,but most importantly you can discuss on who to kill.

Night ability-Take out
Since you are the leader of the coalition every night when you are talking with your fellow members about who to kill YOU are the one that makes the final decision by sending me a PM of the player that you would like dead and the mafioso you want to do it.Choose wisely.

Special ability-Voice of the criminals
As a celebrity you have many powers,some that are even unknown to you,therefore at anytime in the game(other than a gamefreeze) you may try and use your powers for something,and I will tell you the results of your efforts.Your powers can be anything,you just need to imagine.One example is the fact that you can reveal your status as a celebrity.

Attribute-Persuasion
You can only be lynched by reaching the required number of votes for a lynch before the day phase ends.You cannot be lynched by simply having 50% of the votes on you.

Win condition:Match the player count to the number of remaining mafia

7.)You are a member of the mafia coalition and the leader of the Maryland Syndicate,a large and versatile gang that really didn’t specialize in much before joining.But now that you are part of the coalition your task is to help conceal the groups more sinister tasks using a lot of your undercover agents and high knowledge of DC’s streets and locales.This essentially makes you the stealthiest person in town,being able to get away with almost anything.

Masonry-Mafia
You are a member of the mafia, so you can communicate with your fellow mafia members(whose names will be sent to you in another PM)outside the game in the coalition hideout subforum about anything,but most importantly you can discuss on who to kill.

Attribute-Evasive
Huh?Is that guy following you?Pssh,please,he can try but you know more about stalking than anyone else in this town and are immune to night abilities that look at who you visited or who visited you.

Night Ability-Frame
Each night you may PM me the name of one player,if that player has his role or alignment checked he/she will appear as a member of the mafia,if that player has their role revealed to everyone they will appear as their regular self.

Win condition:Match the player count to the number of remaining mafia members

8.)You are the leader of the Vice Lords and the newest addition to the Mafia coalition,recruited just last week to help prepare for the siege on DC. You joined this coalition because your gangs plans kept getting pulled down by the government,and this coalition is going to get rid of that little problem and put you as one of the most powerful men in North America.

Masonry-Mafia
You are a member of the mafia, so you can communicate with your fellow mafia members(whose names will be sent to you in another PM)outside the game in the coalition hideout subforum about anything,but most importantly you can discuss on who to kill.

Night ability-Mop up
You may use this ability once for the duration of the game.Since you are such a new recruit you and your gang are basically doing the coalition's grunt work, and this includes things like cleaning up their messes.So every time you use this ability the person that the mafia killed will not have his role revealed.

Win condition:Match the player count to the number of remaining mafia members

9.)You are the leader of Hell's Horrors, a large motorcycle gang,as well as the biggest,scariest,and most intimidating person in town, your mere presence makes the people around you uneasy.So, as is expected you and your gang are a part of the mafia coalition.

Masonry-Mafia
You are a member of the mafia, so you can communicate with your fellow mafia members(whose names will be sent to you in another PM)outside the game in the coalition hideout subforum about anything,but most importantly you can discuss on who to kill.

Attribute-Intimidation
People are too scared to oppose you alone,so you can usually get away with anything.The coalition leader found a use for this trait of yours,he told you to use it in the daily discussions and now that you do so, all your votes count as two.

Night ability-Army of two
Twice per game you may use this ability.If you do,the mafias night kill target is guaranteed to die.However,there must be at least 1 other mafia member alive for you to use this ability.

Win condition:Match the player count to the number of remaining mafia members

10.)You are the leader of the Prospects,and your gang doesn’t really specialize in anything, BUT with your personal fortune from being in command you do control and employ a large number of hitmen and mercenaries.You yourself are one of the best hired gun money can buy,and thats because you are so resourceful.That’s why you were brought into the coalition,you and your gang function as the hitman wing.

Masonry-Mafia
You are a member of the mafia, so you can communicate with your fellow mafia members(whose names will be sent to you in another PM)outside the game in the coalition hideout subforum about anything,but most importantly you can discuss on who to kill.

Attribute-Scavenger
Remember when I said you were resourceful?Well it’s time to see for yourself,
the coalition leader gave you a big enough check,so big that you are willing to do anything that is if you have the resources for it.Each night you will gain the abilities of the person that was last lynched(If someone was lynched)for 1 night.Some abilities can not be gained.

Night Ability-Contract Killer
Each night you may kill someone,if the coalition members choose to pay the price.How this works is that if you do not use any of your Scavenge abilities and the rest of the coalition members agree not to use any of their abilities(the masonry and regular night kill are excluded)for a night,you may make an extra kill that night for the coalition.If any of them break this promise your kill will fail.This ability will stop working when the coalition leader dies.

Win condition:Match the player count to the number of remaining mafia members

11.)You are the leader of a violent gang known as the 14th Street Gang.The biggest gang in California,and a member of the mafia coalition.

Masonry-Mafia
You are a member of the mafia, so you can communicate with your fellow mafia members(whose names will be sent to you in another PM)outside the game in the coalition hideout subforum about anything,but most importantly you can discuss on who to kill.

Night Ability-Interceptor
On each odd numbered night you may PM me the name of one of your coalition partners,one random person(who is not a coalition member) visiting that player will die.

Attribute-Homesick
Given that your gang comes from all the way across the country you sort of came to the party a little late. And you're still trying to settle in the new locale. This makes you a little cautious, and caution + violence =paranoia.So everytime you get targeted by 2 or more people during a night phase I will notify you,if you PM me back I will tell you the names of every player that targeted you that night,you MUST choose one of those players and kill them.

Attribute-I listen but choose to obey
You are immune to any abilities used on you by the President or one of his allies.

Win condition:Match the player count to the number of remaining mafia members

12.)You are the best hacker in the US and you are part of the illuminati.You and your partners have been working undercover for the past couple of decades but now,with the US government on its knees it is time for the emergence of the new world order.

Ability:Masons
You may communicate with your fellow illuminati members outside of the game via PM,IM,email,etc.The names of the other masons will be sent to you in another PM.

Abilityata breach
Every night you can PM me the name of a player to 'hack'.Once you hack a player you and your team can use many interesting abilities on that player.You cannot hack dead players.

Attribute-You can read the texts that hacked players receive or make.

Ability:Identity theft
Once per game you can PM me the name of a player,you will gain all that players night and special abilities.If you choose a hacked player then you will steal that player's night and special abilities.

Win condition:illuminati wins

13.)You are a member of the illuminati.An aristocrat from a foreign country, you came to the country under orders to assassinate the Secretary of Defense for the benefit of your country,but you stopped when you met the leader of the illuminati.Now with the oppurtunity to surpass your old masters in power you have joined the group so you can overthrow United States the government and rule the world.

Masonry-Illuminati
You may communicate with your fellow illuminati members outside of the game via PM,IM,email,etc.The names of the other masons will be sent to you in another PM.

Ability:O.F.C.C
You are a member of the O.F.C.C(Organized forces to comabt crime),you became one to learn more about the government and climb the ranks,but now that you joined the illuminati you have no need for them,but you still talk to them to learn info.So you can communicate with fellow O.F.C.C members(whos names will be sent to you in another PM)outside the game via PM,IM,email,etc.

Special Ability:The revealing
Once all members of the O.F.C.C have been ‘hacked’ you and your group will be sent a PM containing the names of all current US officials.

Ability:Your revealing
Twice per game you may PM me the name of a player,a vague hint about that player's role will be put in the day update.If the player you chose was hacked then that person's role will be revealed to whole game.

Win condition:illuminati wins

14.)You are the leader of the illuminati,you and your partners have been working undercover for a long time pulling strings in the the perfect opportunity to overthrow and take control of the government,and now is that time.But for you to actually do this the master plan must unfold.And it will no matter what it takes.

Masonry-Illuminati
You may communicate with your fellow illuminati members outside of the game via PM,IM,email,etc.The names of the other masons will be sent to you in another PM.

Ability:It can’t end now!
If your hacker dies you will gain his hacking ability,however it will only have a 50% success rate.

Ability:Shadow organization
Most people don’t think you exist,whether they don’t want to believe it or just don’t know that you do makes no difference.What this means is that if you are targeted by a night ability that checks or reveals your role or alignment it won't work on you.

Win condition:Fulfill the master plan(Have at least one living member anytime after the end of night 13 while all US officials,the coalition leader, and other independents are dead)

15.)You are the most powerful man in the nation,maybe even the world.Some people love you,some people hate you,and some people want to kill you and the country that you rule.But you can’t let that happen.You have a family and nation to protect.You will stop them.You,are the president of the United States.

Masonry-Family ties
You may communicate with your son outside of the game of via PM.The name of your son will be sent to you in another PM.

Masonry-US officials
You may communicate with your fellow US officials outside of the game via PM.The names of the other US officials will be sent to you in another PM.

Attribute-Media blackout
You are currently the man in charge of the country,you control everything,including the media.So any time you or your officials use a night role,it will NOT be shown in the day update.This ability last until your death.

Ability:Raid
The mafia coalition are running this country into the ground,and sadly even you don’t know who exactly is piloting their little campaign,but you'll stop them even if you if you have to use brutality.....So you may PM me during the night ONCE for the whole game.If you do ALL night roles will be nullified,and what's more?If any limited use abilities were used that night,they lose one of their uses.

Night ability-Medal of Honor
Your influence is slowly diminishing, but it's not gone yet.So one time only,you may PM me the name of a player at night that you would like to recognize and award.The next day,that player will have the sole lynching vote.

Win condition:Town wins

16.)You are the current Secretary of State and you work right under the president in his endeavors to put an end to this internal conflict.Although he sometimes makes rash decisions you trust that he,with your help,can stop the coalition and bring the country back on top..

Masonry-US officials
You may communicate with your fellow US officials outside of the game via PM.The names of the other US officials will be sent to you in another PM

Night ability-Taking in your votes
Every night you may PM me the name of a player,you will take over that players vote the next day.You cannot use this the same night as your other ability.

Night ability-Census maker
Each night you may send me a PM saying you will make a census,the results of the census will tell you how much members of the mafia,town,and independents are still alive.

Win condition:Town wins

17.)You are the other party's candidate,and you lost when you ran against the president over 2 years ago. But even though the current president beat you in the election you still agreed to work with him in taking down the coalition and fixing the problems it's creating in order to save the country and keep it alive.A lot of people think you're crazy.

Masonry-US officials
You may communicate with your fellow US officials outside of the game via PM.The names of the other US officials will be sent to you in another PM.

Attribute-Depression
You are depressed about the loss during the election,so you’ve been drinking lately.Which means all of your post should have spelling and/or grammar mistakes.

Night ability-The current state.
You can PM me one message(max 20 words) each night, which you will staple to the door of the Lincoln Memorial.This message will be revealed publicly but the author shall remain anonymous.

Night ability-I’m not a crook
Once per game you may PM me during the night the name of a player that voted for you.That player will be killed.

Win condition:Town wins

18.)You are the president's oldest child,about to turn 18.Your life was good for you until the mafia began their crime spree because now your dad has been really protective of you.

Masonry-Family ties
You may communicate with your father outside the game via PM.The name of your father will be sent to you in another PM

Attribute-Not with the wrong crowd
Your father made sure that you didn't follow a life of crime.Therefore you cannot be killed by any gang members.

Special ability-Inheritance
If the president is killed you will become a US official and gain an entire new role PM.

Win condition:Town wins

19.)You used to be one of the top officers at the station right under the sheriff himself.But ever since the old man’s family was murdered,hes gone soft.So you’re going to stop the mafia coalition without him by creating your own police force, the O.F.C.C.However since times are rough your request has not yet been answered.

Masonry-You are the leader and founder of the O.F.C.C(Organized Force to Combat the Coalition) which lets you communicate with your fellow O.F.C.C members(whose names will be sent to you in another PM) outside the game via PM.

Night ability-Top shot
Now that the old precinct's rules no longer restrict you anymore you can enforce the law in any way you see fit .So each night you may PM me the name of a player.That player will be killed,however if you kill someone who is innocent,you will be punished.The first time you miss,you will try to drink away your guilt gaining the attribute ‘Drinking away the pain’ for the remainder of the game.The second time you miss,you will commit suicide.

Attribute-Drinking away the pain
*NOTE*-this attribute is only applied when you kill an innocent with your ‘Top shot’ ability.
All your post must contain spelling and grammar mistakes(enough to be noticeable)and you cannot vote.
Win condition:Town wins

20.)You are an O.F.C.C grunt,you joined the organization so you could help stop the crime in the city with a little more force than what the regular precinct was doing.

Masonry-You are a member of the O.F.C.C(Organized Forces to Combat the Coalition) which lets you communicate with your fellow O.F.C.C members(whose names will be sent to you in another PM) outside the game via PM.

Night ability-Locked up
As long as you are alive the N.S.P has a factional roleblock and the leader may send in the name of one person every night to be roleblocked.

Attribute-Kevlar plating
You can not be killed by any means of firearms.

Win condition:Town wins

21.)You are second in command for the O.F.C.C.You are also their top surveillance man and intelligence gatherer.

Masonry-N.S.P
You are a member of the O.F.C.C(Organized Forces to Combat the Coalition) which lets you communicate with your fellow O.F.C.C members(whose names will be sent to you in another PM) outside the game via PM.

Night ability-Reconnaissance
Each night you may PM me the name of a player.You will watch that player during the night learning who visited them and who they visited.

Win condition:Town wins

22.)You are a journalist.You used to work for the local news station before it went bankrupt,but because you still have a passion to do your job you continue to write down logs of your opinions on current events in your own personal journal.

Night ability-Voice of the people
Each night you may right down an entry in your journal(maximum of 60 words).You can write about anything,once you’ve written your entry you will PM it to me and when you die,all your entries will be revealed for everyone to see.

Special ability-Between the lines
If you are killed during the night(and only the night) i will notify you and you will PM me the name of a player,that player will have a permanent vote placed on them for the remainder of the next day.

Win condition:Town wins

23.)You are an army man stationed in the hellhole that is DC to help reduce criminal activity.

Attribute-War torn
Due to constant fighting,you will inevitably die at some point unless you somehow reduce the number of mafia coalition members alive.
all members=end of night 4
all except one=end of night 5
all except two=end of night 6
and so one and so forth until all coalition members are dead

Special Ability-Veteran honor
At any time during the game(other than gamefreeze) you may PM me that you want to use this ability. If you do I will publicly reveal this role in the gamethread as belonging to you.

Winc condition:Town wins

24.)You are a mail man. Post-based Jack of all Trades

Special ability-Post office
If you make the first post in a day, you will become a doublevoter for that day.

If you make the last post in a day, you may choose to either track or watch someone the following night.

If you make the most posts in any given day, you will get a one shot kill for the following night.

If you make(or tie for) the least posts in any given day, you will be bulletproof for the following night.

If you accidently merge two or more posts or make an edit, you will show as guilty to all investigations during the following night.

Your first post in each day must start with a player's name other than your own. That player will be made lynch-immune for the day.

If all your post in a day contain the name of the same player.You will learn of that players alignment at the start of the following night.

If you ever destroy(delete) a post,you will get fired and lose all your abilities.

Win condition:Town wins

25.)You are a normal person.Yes a normal person,with a normal job a normal family and basically normal life.

Night ability-Just walk it out
Like every normal person,you are trying to get in shape.So every night you can go for a walk around liberty park,the most popular park in the city.While walking the park you can see one player who used a night ability that night.

Night ability-The basement
You have a homemade fallout shelter in case of a doomsday scenario,and now you have a reason to use it.So any night(you are not walking) you may pm me saying you will use this ability,if you do use this ability you will go into the basement with your friends and family.Unfortunately you never restocked the bunker so you can only stay in there for one night at most.While you are in the basement any abilities that target you at night will not target you and fail.This ability can only be used two times.

Win condition:Town wins