(1) Nintendo Follow-Up [9/21]

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Pokémaniac said:
But
(3) the amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole;
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The site had every single Pokemon! That's the entire thing! As the lawyer himself said, they've gone way above fair usage. Normally this is turned a blind eye to, but if it is going to impact on their sales then they can do what they like to fan sites.
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In my opinion, posting all the sprites or even posting maps, dialogues, etc. doesn't give nearly as much information or entertainment as actually playing the game. That's why game guides (from companies such as 'Prima', etc.) are allowed to publish the walkthroughs that they do. But like I said, its a completely and unarguably subjective matter; yours, Nintendo's and my own opinion can never be considered 'true' or 'correct'.
And as for the possibility of ruining Nintendo's sales, to have a correct opinion on that, you'd need to be psychic. If Nintendo could predict any rise or drop in sales, then a fair few of their actions and marketing ploys wouldn't have gone ahead. Unfortunately, Nintendo has the legal and monetary power to request that certain images be taken down for any reason they please. This is just another case of a giant company ripping away what should be our right to free information.

EDIT: Sorry I reposted this, I didn't know you could reply by quoting another post this before. I'm new to the forums :D
 
@Schwam- I answered the second bit earlier, but to the first bit, it has a substantial effect on the experience and gives away a lot about the rest of the game.
 
Honestly, i think everyone is overreacting over the situation. I believe Nintendo is justified in what their doing because Black and White was praised for it being a refreshing addition to the pokemon franchise so if it's spoiled then what's the point? I know anyone can find out this information if they look hard enough but you have to realize this is currently the most prominent pokemon fan-site there is right now, by making sure this site doesn't spoil images it keeps many people from getting spoiled. Frankly, i was angry when i was on my way to the forums only to see all the pokemon on the front page in my face when i wanted it to surprise me later. It's as if you have to hide from the entire internet to not be spoiled which is pretty much impossible if you frequent it like i do.In my opinion, whoever is in charge of this site should've at least put all the new information somewhere else on the site so people aren't so easily tempted to learn all the information.
 
I say ask them for evidence that they are nintendo.
Cause people can get company info and be big trolls.
EDIT: @NESSTHEFOX if you don't wanna be spoiled don't come here, easy as that.
 
If people don't want to have the game spoiled, there's simple measures that can be taken to avoid it. I have both the forums and the main site bookmarked, so when the gameplay was being posted I only went to the forums since I don't want the story spoiled. Seeing all the new Pokémon and reading their 'dex entries hasn't spoiled much for me and it's only increased my interest in the games.

I don't see why posting images of characters would damage sales. If anything, posting the games' plot would. No one wants to pay to see a movie if the ending is given away, but if you show them a trailer with little clips of the action they'll fork over the cash for more, if they like what they see.
 
@Pokémaniac- Again, it has a substantial effect on the experience in your opinion. Clearly a lot of people feel the pictures seen ahead of release enhance their gameplay experience. And in regards to sales impacts, until someone can legitimately prove that posting pictures hinders sales, then it should be taken out of the equation.
P.S. Sorry, I didn't see your post before.

@FireGrey - The letter is legitimate. WPM has stated that he has plenty of evidence to prove they're Nintendo.

And to everyone who takes the stance that Nintendo was justified in doing it so as to prevent the game being ruined for people, its not as if there is some magical power forcing everyone to read what is posted on this, or any other pokemon fan site. Maybe if Nintendo had requested for the sites to simply put a sign up clearly alerting visitors to spoilers, then there would be no need for censorship. People would enter at their own risk. In fact, Serebii does (and has for a very long time) put all spoilers in hidden javascript tabs. I repeat, no one is being forced to look at spoilers, but with Nintendo censoring all images, they've literally stripped us of our freedom to information.
 
I have been coming to this site for B&W info and when I read the letter I just had to post.

Since Big N did this, I have be appalled by it. With DP why didn't Big N also "attack" when DP was out in japan and not the US? Is it because of they think the games would not do well?

What I believe is happening is since B&W got perfect scores, in japan. Big N is being over protective.

Big N can't stop the internet nor can they stop the vanishing of borders. I have found all of the images they wanted gone from this site, serebii, and other sites from a little thing called GOOGLE. Lets see if Big N takes on GOOGLE.

I have been a loyal fan of Pokemon since the GAME BOY POCKET and COLOR with RED and BLUE. I will still buy B&W, but why haven't they attacked other Pokemon games being covered like Pokemon Ranger and other Pokemon based games that have been covered in the past BEFORE they were released here?

Sorry if this is a bit cut and paste I woke up early and I am angry with Big N.
 
It's not really your right. They are their images, and they reserve all rights. And Schwam, I know not everyone wants to stay spoiler-free, but Nintendo's market research has clearly led them to believe that knowing these things before time will hamper your experience. Whether it's true or not, it's the owner's opinion and can't just be striked out of the equation.

I honestly think it's a bit silly you feel your rights are being taken away, when for you to have those rights Nintendo has to lose rights. You know, Nintendo, the ones that made the stuff, have lots of money, and obviously very good lawyers?

And I think that blocking spoilers isn't entirely the point. Like I said, if you're a kid, who likes Pokemon but isn't huge on it, and you see the new Pokemon, you may say "Cool!" and then beg your parents for the game... only to find out it isn't out for a few months. So you whinge and you whine, but in that time you forget about it. you see a picture of a Pokemon in a magazine you bought... but who cares? You've seen it already. The whole thing just fades from your mind and you never get around to buying the game.

So it's not that Nintendo doesn't want people that don't want the game spoiled to have it spoiled, it's that they don't want the kids to spoil it, get hyped, stop caring, and ignore the franchise. This is why the games are marketed the way they are, with a few Pokemon dropped a month. it keeps you on your toes, waiting for the games, so you don't stop caring until the game is firmly in your hands and the money firmly in Nintendo's pocket.
 
@Pokémaniac I'd have to say if the kids were really hyped about buying the games, they wouldn't lose interest that quickly. I remember seeing drawings of the second generation Pokémon in some magazine (can't recall the name) when I was younger, and it was before the games were released in America or the Pokémon had English names. I remember being excited when I first saw them and just as excited to learn I could finally buy the games. Heck, Pokémon Silver was the whole reason why I upgraded to a GameBoy Color!

Then again, times have changed since I was kid. Maybe kids these days have short attention spans or far too many distractions to keep excited about something cool they saw months ago.
 
Ok, so I may be overreacting a little about the whole rights issue :p but I still stand by the fact that Nintendo shouldn't hide information when it's already released. If they didn't want this to happen, then they should have done a simultaneous, worldwide release. I would have been happy to wait an extra few months for them to translate the game.

Pokémaniac said:
...if you're a kid, who likes Pokemon but isn't huge on it, and you see the new Pokemon, you may say "Cool!" and then beg your parents for the game... only to find out it isn't out for a few months. So you whinge and you whine, but in that time you forget about it. you see a picture of a Pokemon in a magazine you bought... but who cares? You've seen it already. The whole thing just fades from your mind and you never get around to buying the game.
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but think you just described a spoiler. If fansites have clear warnings about this type of information, then the kids don't need to worry as they don't have to look at it.
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but think you just described a spoiler. If fansites have clear warnings about this type of information, then the kids don't need to worry as they don't have to look at it.
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Most kids at a young age don't understand the concept of spoilers, but meh, that's nether here nor there.

To me, it's not so much anything WPM mentioned, but the way he handled the situation. What he has to remember is that he is a public figure (Yes, I know, but he is quite well known in the Poke-fan community), and whilst he tried to solve the situation with humour, he ended up aggravating it, and steering it up. His actions were completely immature (and in my opinion unfunny, but that depends on the individual's type of humour), whilst others like Serebii or Pokejungle actually tried to do something about it in a mature manner.


I can understand WPM's anger, but Nintendo are 100% in there right, and whilst I am not saying what they did was right (Because Nintendo freaking screwed the pooch on this one), I think WPM handled it in the wrong way.

I am a regular reader of the site, and have been for a while, just throwing my two cents out there.
 
I still don't think NoA made much sense with this one. They don't own the game, they didn't develop it. They just translate it, something that anyone that reads Japanese can do. I could understand this if it was from Nintendo HQ in Japan.

Which brings up my question. Could Nintendo HQ have told NoA to send the e-mail out? If they did, the situation is pretty much decided.
 
Okay, so I joined mainly to post this snippit from Kotaku's article on the issue:

"Charlie Scibetta, Nintendo of America's senior director of Corporate Communications, tells Kotaku "Nintendo supports and appreciates the efforts that Pokémon fans go through to create fan sites. In most cases there is no issue with the content that is posted, but on this occasion we had to contact a select few websites to ask them to take down confidential images."
[Article here]

So...he basically restated what the lawyer said. The way I see it, all of the frustration is over the lack of communication...
 
(My quote button isn't working) UnicornsExist's Quote - I can understand WPM's anger, but Nintendo are 100% in there right, and whilst I am not saying what they did was right (Because Nintendo freaking screwed the pooch on this one), I think WPM handled it in the wrong way.


In my honest opinion, WPM handled this whole ordeal quite well! Nintendo is in no way 100% right! All the images that were put up came from people in Japan that had their games sent to them a day early in the mail. That automatically makes the games public knowledge. Once anything is released to the general public, a company can't deem anything from it as CONFIDENTIAL! Therefore the images that were up were not unlawful to post on the site. Also there is no proof that images came from a rom plus the fact that games WERE RELEASED BEFORE THE IMAGES WERE POSTED! This whole thing is just silly. It just seems like Nintendo is trying to pick on people that don't have the power or means to fight back against a large company. SMH! WPM handle this properly.
 
If they were picking on them, they would have been a lot hasher. They've let the sites keep all other material, even if they are boarding copyright over Fair Use, and even let Serebii start posting images (though I expect some law use used in this). It wasn't a good move, but being mean it wasn't. Bad move, but not mean. The thing about it is this, it may be in the public, and it will leak somehow, but by law the images and use of the images are still owned by Nintendo. I'm not defending them, but I'm not going to damn them either. I didn't say ANYTHING about the ROM, either. Nintendo own the copyright, and if they want to, they could take all Pokemon fansites down in a flash, and some companies have done that in the past. It's about intellectual property.

What I'm saying is WPM decided to bite the hand that feeds, and whilst no-one took it lying down, the way this site handled it was.....terrible. His anger was justified, but the way he treated it was horrendous.

Edit: Better way of putting it is this way:
It does damage Nintendo, because the information is revealed, and people can get the information from fan-sites instead of going on there site, or buying the magazines they sponsor, ect. It comes down to money, and whilst not right, is completely in there rights to do so.
 
Nintendo has proven a long time ago that they will stomp on their fans, both dedicated and not. I'm more used to see them forgetting their past just to promote something new - unfortunately, the creature in OP's avatar being promoted in favor of the original badass bipedal Pokemon.

If Nintendo was so quick to give a big middle finger to the Mewtwo fanbase via the Brawl roster, what makes you think that they wouldn't do the same to those they feel are doing something to cost them money? (And in this case, they realize that the design of so many of the new Pokemon is so poor that people seeing them before the game is purchased is a likely turnoff from buying the game.)
 
Old man here. Lawyers aren’t evil in general … however very few of them have much expertise in technical matters or in regards to games. I honestly wouldn’t expect even a “Nintendo” lawyer to know what a “sprite” was off the top of his head.

I also agree with the analysis that Nintendo is trying to keep control of it’s content. My guess is that this happens because they have contracts with various gaming magazines and whatnot to release information early about the product before it comes out in the US. They probably can’t make as much money of those exclusive deals if fan sites like this one already have nearly everything out in the open.

That said, it’s dumb.

WPM is correct in that it appears that Nintendo is trying to cling to a business model that doesn’t make sense in an age where fans worldwide are connected via the internet and information is easily available on Japanese websites that anyone in the world can visit should they choose to take the time. It’s corporate stupidity at its finest.
 
http://albotas.com/post/1138189665/one-big-ass-picture-of-all-156-new-pokemon

many people agrees that pokemons of B&W are mostly CRAP... the designs looks horrible.. some of them are like digimons, while others looks like yu-gi-oh monsters, and also there are those looks like a gradeschooler drawing of animals or creatures with wierd colors.. so there's no point for Nintendo to do such act because there's nothing special about the generation V pokemons...
 
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