Lost World?

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I think a Dialga tech would do the job well. Just take prizes like you normally would and then Deafen the rest of the game.

What some people are forgetting is that they won't play the stadium if there's not 6 Pokemon in their Lost Zone UNLESS they have another one in their hand or are facing Sablock, a relitively hard matchup for them actually.
 
DNA this is not a English lesson so if you want to correct people I suggest you go back to school. And as far as lost world goes. Just like rare candy got nerfed so will it. PUSA will not let one card be that dominant. IF we do get lost world don't be surprised if the translation get so that you would have to wait a turn to declare yourself the winner. And also it will be pretty hard to get 6 pokemon in the lost zone. Smart player will understand the threat and wouldn't how pokemon in hand. Just how people thought Vilegar was so big but as we know now there are a number of was to counter it. But to end this if we do get lost world we would get trainers or supports to remove pokemon from the lost zone.
 
Tifton, DNA was correcting a BAD TYPO that made me seem like I was babbling... He modified my sentence to make it logical and valid. Tifton, you don't seem to know about the history of the game that much. Transciever engine was in NEARLY every deck in the DS-onish time. PUSA let Claydol go in... let's be honest... every single deck pre-platinum. Uxie IS in every single deck now. LostWorld IS NOT broken. It will not be used as much as cards like Claydol and Uxie. Using your logic, Uxie is too good of a card because every one plays it, so it should be nerfed. Same thing goes with Collector and Bebe's search. THOSE cards are way more dominant that Lost World. They let Luxray G LV X go for a long time as undisputed BDIF. They will not Nerf LW because it does not need to. The think about LostGar is that if it has a good enough engine (VS Hunter), it will not need to go up against a bad player to win. VileGar was just a slow deck that sacrificed many things to be cool. LostGar will not have that problem. None-the-less, LostGar will be big, but balanced. Getting cards to remove mon from LZ is stupid. That, once again, destroys the gimmick of the LZ. That is not going to happen... ever... PUI does not destroy their gimmicks.
 
So why was rare candy nerfed??? Because They realized broken it would be to play trainers on the first turn and use rare candy. So they changed that. And as far as Claydol uxie and other goes those cards are not broken. They are just good. During it's time any deck could run Claydol and the same goes for uxie and so on. So that point is invalid. As for lost world there is only a handful of pokemon that befenits from lost world. And after the rotation that list will get even smaller. So you pretty much will have a stadium.Your right pokemon international wont mess up their gimmicks but pokemon USA will. Im not worried about lost world one bit. But I do realize it would suck for the meta game. Also please don't compare this to SP. Because if I'm not mistaken most of the top decks now either SP or have SP in them poketurns, Crobat Gs.....
 
DNA this is not a English lesson so if you want to correct people I suggest you go back to school.
Click to expand...
This is an intelligent discussion. And as such everyone participating in it should be accurate in what information they present. Zero said 'supporter lock' instead of 'stadium lock', which is what Deafen does. It was an honest mistake and I wanted to point it out before people start asking why he said the wrong thing.

If you're afraid of me correcting you, go back to school.
 
Rare Candy was not nerfed in a traditional sense. It was changed for the new format. By your concept, Great Ball was also nerfed because it got changed for the worse. You have a very poor definition of "broken". You claim that Lost World is broken, but Uxie, Claydol, and Luxray LV X are not? You have provided zero evidence on the concept that LW is broken. You have not stated why it is broken. You even gave a reason why it is NOT broken. Thus, using your argument, LW not broken... it is just very good. Your argument is invalid. Not even every deck can run LW and it does not provide any form of an imbalance over the format. There ARE only a few cards that LW helps. Same thing with Poketurn, Energy Gain, SPDar, and so on. What's your point there? Having cards that benefit certain decks split the format in a good way. Before, we had very cookie cutter decks where I could build a Stage 2 deck and only change out the pokemon and energies. Now, different decks need different trainers, supporters, and stadiums.

You are saying that PUI will not ignore a gimmick, but PUSA will? As I recall, PUI gets the final say. PUSA has always respected the gimmicks of cards. In Power Keepers... they had some BAD cards. They never made a Holon Supporter that didn't discard or a Delta Pokemon that wasn't an odd type. PUSA has not shown to make any USA only cards that breaks a gimmick... nor should they.

Perhaps give a reason WHY LW would be bad for the metagame? I have tested it extensively. All I can see the deck doing is extending the gap of bad players and good players. Bad Players will huddle around the supposed BDIF... which is very hard to build correctly. Thus, they will go FARTHER into the back tables. The good players will add LostGar to their list of decks that they may want to play. Adding new decks to a format is not a bad thing. It will win tournaments as all good decks should. Will it win worlds? Maybe. I could not predict that. If worlds would be held post Call, I believe it could have a chance of winning. Who knows?

As far as your main argument, I don't get it. You seem to believe that LW is unfair because it can only be used in a few decks. Well... welcome to most card games. Let's talk magic. Wrath of God must be Unfair because only white decks can play it. Same thing with Jace in Blue and Garruk in Green. In Yugioh, Judgement Dragon must be unfair because it only goes in Lightsworn, RIGHT?! You have no problem with SP because it is supposedly in every deck. A truly unfair card is one that punishes me VERY HEAVILY for not using it. I can survive not using Collector, SP, Bebe, etc, but if I don't use <CARD X> I am clearly at a disadvantage. That is my definition of Unfair cards. For example, the old Neo Slowking was unfair. It gave the opponent a (.5)^n when n is the number of slowking in play chance of letting a supporter resolve. There was nothing else that could do well against it at the time. THAT card was unfair. Lost World is not unfair. It may have REALLY GOOD matchups, but it can still be beaten. The reason I mentioned Luxray X is because People believed that you NEEDED to play it in any deck. That is the traditional definition of unfair cards. It gained price quickly because of this thought. Your definition of unfair seems to claim that because Luxray X can be used in everything, it is not unfair. The traditional definition of unfair would say that IF Luxray X MUST be used in everything, it is unfair.

Now then, as to Rare Candy, it can only be used in a few decks. The reason it got "nerfed" is because of the way the new rules were set up. Traditionally, a person can play it turn 1 (if they go second). Now, they cannot. This will prevent donks... making games last longer. It still does what it should, but is adapted to fit the new rules. Lost World will not be "nerfed" for a few reasons. First, it does not make short games. Most CCG developers DESPISE short 1/2 turn games. Look at yugioh: banning any OTK strategies. Rare Candy was not broken... it simply created short games. Look at basic pokemon now: there is no modern day Riolu DP. They realized that Donking is no fun, and thus, there should be no more Riolu DP. Now then, if you would, if Candy got nerfed, basic pokemon did too. Lost World decks take their time to win. Secondly, it would create an imbalance in formats. Having LostWorld as a different card would make worlds a giant mess.... The Japanese and Americans would not know the same card called "LostWorld". Finally, LOST WORLD IS NOT BROKEN. Read above if you are still too against my comments. >.< I've gone into enough detail on this. Lost World just adds a deck to the format with good matchups. I would say that when LuxChomp was developed, it had better matchups as a whole than Lost World does right now. I'm JUST SAYING.
 
Zero's completely correct. LW isn't broken.
The point about Rare Candy is invalid, if I understand why it was changed. I believe it was changed because it wasn't being used the way it was intended; that is, Pokémon never wanted to go from basic to stage 1 on T1 for the donk. And they didn't want it to go to even Stage 2 T1 for the donk. Or play a pokémon and get it set up to Stage 1 that same turn. It was just never meant to do that, so it was changed.
 
No say it isn't so. You just didnt write all of that for little Ol me. I feel so loved. I could go on and on about that and many more topics but, I'm not. What I will say is this no one here knows any of those answers. Only time will tell what will happen. People thought we would get it in the last set and it didn't happen. I remember people being so pissed at prerelease at no Lost World. Remember Pokemon is not doing this for the fan it's for the money. Hints the reason why we getting this "filler" set.
 
Look Zero, you are saying that Lost World is not broken, and there is a lot of way of beating it. Go ahead and tell us, as you are sooo experienced. Or you don t want to share it with us? And, before you post, don t tell me to put a dialga G inside of my deck. Then, put some Garchomp and throw the SP system inside. Oh my god! Isn t that Dialchomp? Wow, the meta will be Lostgar and Dialchomp. Dialchomp enable the set of Stadiums, but Lostgar players will find a way to put their stadiums.
Oh, plus, are there that much counter against this deck than Vilegar? Again, tell me if there is.

In MY OPINION, lost world is broken because (First, for me, broken means something that makes a hole in the rules. For exemple, the neo Slowking. I think it is broken because it does not let the opponent use their supporters, which make the card useless and plus, it make it put it on the top of it player s deck, which makes that player to draw a non useful card. If you don t accept my definitions, free for you to do so) :

1, What was the three ways of winning in pokemon? Draw all the prizes, your opponent does not have cards in his deck and when your opponent runs out of pokemon on the field. Principally, the first one is the goal, and the others are situational. With lost World, you add another way of winning. And this way surpasse the old one. Don t tell me that it is not. Then why this card is so much talked then? Imagine another way: you can directly win the game if, with dialga palkia Legend, you put more than 45 cards in your opponent s prize. Wow, this win technique will sooo be used. Sure I am being sarcastic but yeah. Please don t tell me to compare the SP system with Lostworld. Maybe SPs were cheap, but it still uses the first way of winning.

2, Lost world is a new way to win, that has its own cards to use with. Come on, Pokemon TCG will put another goal, but only certain cards can achieve this. Doesn t that means that a lot of players will try to fill that by only playing with Gengar and mew (and other stuff). Most of all, this way is faster than taking some prizes.

3, Lost world is broken because a deck aroud it has power to lost zone pokemons from your opponent s hand, therefore, that player can never use it from now. I don t think that a player would put some random pokemons, so the important one are not lost zoned. Already, this is getting pretty annoying. VS Gyarados, you can lost zone Magicarps, that will decrease the damage output. VS Gengar SF, you can lost zone Gengar itself. Sure, those are the first turns, but still, it affects big. In the end, I will just win because I lost Zone 6, and nothing can stop it (besides Dialchomp, but by putting a, I don t know, Gliscor UD, you paralyse and you use LW next turn. Poke turn? Just keep doing that, he will run off of that one day. He can t use dragon rush or other attacks, because it will be autowin for you). I forgot, when rotation comes, yeah! No dialga G even!

Please don t tell me that Lostgar is slow. It is a Stage 2 deck, and just with Gengar, in 6 turns, you win. Play a gengar prime with BTS or Rare Candy, just like a Stage 2 deck normally do, and attach a psychic energy. Bang, lost zone one pokemon (It is kind of desruptive too). Next, turn, I get attacked. Then, Rescue to Gengar. Lostzone one more. You keep doing this until you win. Sure, Judge, Spiritomb, Looker and Seeker will be included.

True, I haven t playtest with it, but it is really simple for me, because it has the same build as a Stage 2 deck, but with a lot of Disruptive stuff (mentionned above). I don t even know why everyone is putting mew, waste. Gengar Prime s attack will become a One hit KO attack each turn (that, depending on the number of psychic energies, will send more, or kill more) when LW will be out.

I believe that LW will be out, but sure, there will be counters simular to Dialga G, but as a tech, not a deck.

@Tiftonhotchild
DNA takes time to correct what Zero had forgotten and you are insulting him, wow. By your "hint", PUSA will take LW out for sure and put it as a Extreme Rare (after Ultra). Therefore, everybody will keep buying that pack. On ebay, it will be a 500 $ card, as it is extremely rare. I am exagerating but yeah, you get the point.

PS: Zero, Scizor said:"Zero's completely correct." Put it in your Signature.
 
Look Zero, you are saying that Lost World is not broken, and there is a lot of way of beating it. Go ahead and tell us, as you are sooo experienced. Or you don t want to share it with us? And, before you post, don t tell me to put a dialga G inside of my deck. Then, put some Garchomp and throw the SP system inside. Oh my god! Isn t that Dialchomp? Wow, the meta will be Lostgar and Dialchomp. Dialchomp enable the set of Stadiums, but Lostgar players will find a way to put their stadiums.
Oh, plus, are there that much counter against this deck than Vilegar? Again, tell me if there is.

In MY OPINION, lost world is broken because (First, for me, broken means something that makes a hole in the rules. For exemple, the neo Slowking. I think it is broken because it does not let the opponent use their supporters, which make the card useless and plus, it make it put it on the top of it player s deck, which makes that player to draw a non useful card. If you don t accept my definitions, free for you to do so) :

1, What was the three ways of winning in pokemon? Draw all the prizes, your opponent does not have cards in his deck and when your opponent runs out of pokemon on the field. Principally, the first one is the goal, and the others are situational. With lost World, you add another way of winning. And this way surpasse the old one. Don t tell me that it is not. Then why this card is so much talked then? Imagine another way: you can directly win the game if, with dialga palkia Legend, you put more than 45 cards in your opponent s prize. Wow, this win technique will sooo be used. Sure I am being sarcastic but yeah. Please don t tell me to compare the SP system with Lostworld. Maybe SPs were cheap, but it still uses the first way of winning.

2, Lost world is a new way to win, that has its own cards to use with. Come on, Pokemon TCG will put another goal, but only certain cards can achieve this. Doesn t that means that a lot of players will try to fill that by only playing with Gengar and mew (and other stuff). Most of all, this way is faster than taking some prizes.

3, Lost world is broken because a deck aroud it has power to lost zone pokemons from your opponent s hand, therefore, that player can never use it from now. I don t think that a player would put some random pokemons, so the important one are not lost zoned. Already, this is getting pretty annoying. VS Gyarados, you can lost zone Magicarps, that will decrease the damage output. VS Gengar SF, you can lost zone Gengar itself. Sure, those are the first turns, but still, it affects big. In the end, I will just win because I lost Zone 6, and nothing can stop it (besides Dialchomp, but by putting a, I don t know, Gliscor UD, you paralyse and you use LW next turn. Poke turn? Just keep doing that, he will run off of that one day. He can t use dragon rush or other attacks, because it will be autowin for you). I forgot, when rotation comes, yeah! No dialga G even!

Please don t tell me that Lostgar is slow. It is a Stage 2 deck, and just with Gengar, in 6 turns, you win. Play a gengar prime with BTS or Rare Candy, just like a Stage 2 deck normally do, and attach a psychic energy. Bang, lost zone one pokemon (It is kind of desruptive too). Next, turn, I get attacked. Then, Rescue to Gengar. Lostzone one more. You keep doing this until you win. Sure, Judge, Spiritomb, Looker and Seeker will be included.

True, I haven t playtest with it, but it is really simple for me, because it has the same build as a Stage 2 deck, but with a lot of Disruptive stuff (mentionned above). I don t even know why everyone is putting mew, waste. Gengar Prime s attack will become a One hit KO attack each turn (that, depending on the number of psychic energies, will send more, or kill more) when LW will be out.

I believe that LW will be out, but sure, there will be counters simular to Dialga G, but as a tech, not a deck.

@Tiftonhotchild
DNA takes time to correct what Zero had forgotten and you are insulting him, wow. By your "hint", PUSA will take LW out for sure and put it as a Extreme Rare (after Ultra). Therefore, everybody will keep buying that pack. On ebay, it will be a 500 $ card, as it is extremely rare. I am exagerating but yeah, you get the point.

PS: Zero, Scizor said:"Zero's completely correct." Put it in your Signature.
 
Zitong, your argument can barely be called an argument. First of all, here are a bunch of decks that can beat LostGar: <put the entire format here>. Particularly, DialgaChomp has a really easy time with LostGar. Dos does well if the player has some tact. VileGar also does pretty well against LostGar. VileGar really hurts most of the trainer-happy LostGar builds I've been seeing around here. Your first two points were the same thing. To both of those, I say, get with the times. Yugioh had Exodia and Final. Magic had that one card where you win by having 40 life. New win conditions are not broken. We had MANY unwritten win conditions in the past... you are only whining about this one being written. Was Chatot MD broken because it could lock a Spiritomb (w/o Warp energy) into a GG? I'd say no. IT was a win condition... it COULD be played against... but because some people didn't, it became a very easy win condition. Look at the Sablock. That deck's REAL win condition is to keep your opponent out of a good hand. The goal is to take prizes, but the real goal is to make your opponent lose. I often tell new Sablock players that the goal is not to win, it is to make your opponent lose. You can go for a T1 LostGar, but that will deconsistencize your deck for the rest of the game unless you get a really good start. Most LostGars I've seen become very trainer happy. That is fine... but because of the nature of the deck, it will slow down really bad late game. You must remember that after Turn 1/2, your only supporter will be Hunter. Do you know how much that hurts? Basically, your only draw is 1 uxie per turn. Gengar may be able to do early damage, but it will get damaged badly later on if it does. As far as early discarding, the player in target will either be hit turn one, which hurts Gengar later on as mentioned previously, or he'll have a turn to do something tactful. 50% of the time (HACKED COIN), I'll go 2nd. When I go 2nd, I'll have time to make some move to get mon in play or out of my hand. The other 50% of the time, I'm in risk of getting Gengar'd, but if I survive from there, I can turn the game around. As far as only LZ cards using LW... that's a step for the better. You probably didn't play this format, but years ago, all decks were very cookie cutter. I had my Stage 2 engine, my stage 1 engine, and my hybrid engine. There was no mixing. Now, decks use different engines. LostGar has much different needs than Machamp which has different needs from SP which has different needs than Gyarados. Get it? If we had cards that everybody would be happy to max out on, our engines would look different. Just because LW is a stadium does not change the fact that it can be an archetype. No other decks can use Gyarados SF in them. Only a deck dedicated to Dos SF can use Dos SF to maximum effect. Why is LW different than Dos SF? Dos SF has a very valid win condition: 90/turn. LW has a win condition too: 6 LZ'd Mon. Problems with that?

Your definition is also completely invalid. By your definition, SP would be broken because they are basic pokemon while they should be Stage 1/2. Deltas must also be broken because they are not the right type and they have weird weaknesses. Spiritomb, Vileplume, and Dialga G must also be broken because they make your opponents cards not work, right? Power Spray is TERRIBLE because it negates a power, RIGHT?!
 
@Wong Zitong:
We still don't know the rotation yet, and it's not a crime to agree with Zero. I agree with him right now.

LW just is adding a new deck to the mixture of many meta decks. Whether it will be the new BDIF, I don't care. Regice gets rid of 2 of the pokemon in your hand per turn, Jumpluffs point is to play all your Pokemon, etc. LostGar isn't necessarily a a Stage 2 deck either. I said this in the 'Will Gyarados Survive' thread also.

T1. See Off Gengar w/Mew
Right their, if you don't start with a Mew, you will be one turn slower.

T2. Put up to 2 Pokemon in the Lost zone
You can't do that if you don't have 2 energys.

People have to stop thinking of the best case scenarios (for your opponent).

What if you donk them?
What if they get a bad hand?
What if they can't get a Mew?
What if they can't get energys?
What if their Gengar Primes (supposing the run 2) are all prized?

Not I like Lost World, but it isn't that broken the more you think about it(and test it).
 
@Zitong do you realize that Nintendo doesn't make any money off third party sales. So even if a card goes for 200 on eBay pokemon does not see any of that. If LW comes out it will be an uncommon card. Secondly the US people don't have money like that to spend so I highly doubt packs will be flying out the self. It has gotten so bad for pokemon players that in most stores the pokemon selection has been reduced to one tiny self. Even in card shop have stop carring as much of the supplies. But these ultra rares are easier to obtain now so of anything the price will be 10-15 dollars. Besides that nice argument.
 
@Tiftonhotchild
What I meant was that if LW is an Ultra rare, a person who buys 4 packs will have less chance of getting a LW than if that card was uncommon. Therefore, to get 4 LW to do a Lostgar deck, you need to buy, lets say, 100 boosters, compared 20 packs, if it is common. The 500 $ is just to show you how rare it is.

@Zero
So you are saying that most of the decks can win in 6-7 turns? I am wondering if you have playtest it or not. After my post, I directly went on Redshark and did an RANDOM Lostgar deck, which include Mew, Gengar, some trainers and LW (I don t even know why I wrote that, everyone knows...). I put some collectors, even if it is barely used. All I say was that I did the deck in 2 minutes. And guess what? THIS DECK WINS AGAINST ALMOST EVERY COMPETITIVE DECKS. Please don t say:" Fake! Even if it is true, you don t even know how to play with Vilegar and stuff..." Sure, this deck has some difficulty with Dialga, but it can pass it because mew can just be benched and Gengar can be sent. What you have said in the first few sentences is pratically useless. You are exactly doing what everybody is doing when they see a new card (Ex: LW). Oh, don t be scared, I can easily beat it. I just need to bring 30 cards from my deck and the combo is down, you get it?
Then, you are saying that the goal of pokemon is not just taking the prize? Lets see, Sablock s goal is to lock your opponent, but then, as your opponent can t do anything, you snipe with Garchomp to TAKE ALL YOUR PRIZES. Gyrados s goal is to send 3 Magicarps into the discard pile, so it can do 90 damage with zero energy. Why do so? Because it will increase your speed to TAKE ALL YOUR PRIZES. Your goals are just small ones to get to the win conditions.
A new way to win the game is interesting, when it can be applied to everyone s deck. Are you going to put a Lost World in what ever deck, like Luxchomp? Most of all, as I said, this way surpass the old one, making it cheap and broken. Yu-gi-oh s Exodia can be fit into every deck. But it does not have that much chance of winning with it. This win condition is not that easy, as you have to keep the other piece in your hand, while changing your cards, and put defense creatures. But in the end, you know that it is not that good. Let see LW now. It is faster and can only be included with Mew and Gengar, Which takes too much space, or the win condition will not be fulled.
Remember, you said that my only Supporter will be Hunter. That would be awsome, as I am sure to get a "KO" and plus, another Uxie drop. Houray! Have you play test it? You can use Judge, Looker, Spiritomb, VS Seeker...
Look, with all the opponent-shuffle techs and the Lost Zone part, it is very disruptive too. Gengar has 130 hp, so let say two turns to knock it out. T-1 Psychic T-2 Rescue T-3 I revive with Rescue and BTS (Rare candy) and attach Psychic. In six turns, supposing that with all those Shuffle, you LZ 6 pokemon, you win. Maybe 8 turns, adding another turn for the start and for luck fail.
Stop comparing Dos with LW. But 90 damage is a KO attack each turn? Plus, a new way of playing whould be offered to everyone, but I already said that.
Sp pokemon, considered as a basic instead of a Stage 2, are they as powerful as, for exemple, Magnezone? No. A card s Stat is what is important. Don t compare it with the pokemon that is drawn on it. All the cards mentionned above (Vileplume, Dialga G...) need somthing to sacrifice, or require something first. But the degree of that sacrifice compound the effect. Compared to LW, the degree is really low, compare to ther effect.

By saying all that, I can say that YOUR ARGUMENTS are invalid. I am pretty sure you are going to say that mine are too in your next post, but I will just do the same.
 
eff it
you guys are getting worked up over a single card, and for what? To try and say that Lost World is or is not broken?

A lot of decks can tech in a Dialga G, not just SPs. It's really easy to add a 1-1 line of the thing and have it as a backup attacker. Lost World can only really be run in a single deck type. And once your opponent knows that, they can plan accordingly. It isn't that big of the element of surprise.

Your walls of text are all continually boring me. But, so I can walk out of the topic on a lighter note,
I remember people being so maded at prerelease at no Lost World.
Click to expand...
That was seriously the most awesome thing ever.
 
Zitong, my first few posts basically said that every deck in the metagame CAN beat LostGar. You asked me to name decks that can beat it, so I did. I thought you would be happy. :< Once again, if you've played Sablock, you would know that best case scenario, you make your opponent lose and then you take prizes. The deck has a real hard time if it cannot lock your opponent down. Thus, the win condition is to lock your opponent into a bad hand and then take prizes. If I do not lock, I may be able to satisfy my secondary win condition, taking prizes, but not my primary one. I will win 90% of the time when I satisfy my FIRST win condition. The secondary one means I will just win... but the first one is how I USUALLY win. What I was saying was that decks don't always play for prizes as their first priority.

You appear to be BARELY reading my posts. Gyarados's win condition is to be attacking optimally every turn with dos. What I said about Dos is that it ONLY works in its own deck. Dos cannot go in any other deck... he's a chubby little kid like that... only goes in his own decks. I dare ask you if YOU have playtested Gar. Your comment about my Hunter theory appears to show little thought. Most decks will remove as many pokemon as they can from their hands and decks. Judge and Looker are terrible cards for this. Judge is 4 draw... when the opponent does not have many pokemon in deck, the odds of something good happening are very low. Looker lets them draw as many cards as they want... not good. Spiritomb is DECENT, and a lot of people like it, but same thing goes with Judge. It has a higher chance of getting a LZ, but having a certain LZ is so much better. VS Seeker is not a Supporter so I don't know what you meant when you listed that. VS Seeker is used to get Hunter back. Hunter gives you an autoLZ and a free heal/uxie/mesprit. Hunter is the optimal way to play the deck. The way the deck plays, once your opponent has their optimal attacker, they will not need to have cards in hand. Locking and Disruption are not words to describe this deck. You may delay their first attacker, but once it comes, they will keep it.

As far as my comment on SP, it was in direct response to your "hole in the rules"... thing. Your definition is also very off. How do Vileplume and Dialga G have more to sacrafice to get them in play than Lw? LW basically needs its own deck to be good. I can tech Plume and Dialga in about anything I want to. They lock cards thus creating " a hole" in the cards you are able to play. Thus, by your definition, they are broken.

I'm not going to be posting as much in this thread. I've made my point. You aren't even making an argument even more... just posting because you want to. The deck may take 6 turns to win, but my Luxchomp deck can take that many too. Machamp can also. I don't know why 6 is the magic number for you. You say that the deck wins against "almost every deck". I will refer you to the Law of Large Numbers. Perhaps play a few more games? I doubt you have the ability to play all top decks many times in 12 hours. Also, this is like most decks. It has good matchups and bad matchups. It may have few bad matchups, but those bad matchups (especially Dialga G) are REALLY BAD matchups that are nearly unwinnable. Just sayin' ;D
 
You know what, Zero? Lets just stop talking about this topic. I can continue arguying, but it seems to be a waste of time, as no one really want to change his side. I know that LW will be out, and this is for sure. But I am sure that there will be counters in the BW new set, or even in the Call of Legend set. I don t know, but something like Hariyama ex, but one the bench too, or something like Golduck delta.

Anyway, just to tell you that you don t read my post too, as I said I playtest it against powerful decks. If you don t believe me, then there is nothing to argue about, as everyone will just "lie" so the others will believe us.

This is getting seriously annoying...

:)Peace man, Peace...:)
 
I read your post. I'm sure you playtested it against good decks. My argument to that was the Law of Large numbers. You posted 12 hours your original post. Good data for this type of thing cannot be taken in 12 hours. AS I ALSO SAID, the deck is very good and has many good matchups. Thus, your abridged data agreed. You claim that it beat almost every deck... which is what should happen. The deck is balanced by terrible matchups against only a few things. If anything, your posts have been a waste of time. I never even started "arguying" with you... just stated most of your faults. Big difference ;D I'm not seeing any counters in BW. WE ALREADY HAVE A DIRECT HARD COUNTER TO LOST WORLD! Why do we need another? Dialga G is not very hard to drop down... and hard counters Lost World. We will not see anything returning LZ'd mon, nor will we. I'm willing to bet that BW ignores the very existence of lost zone as LZ was introduced as Platinum's second gimmick (first being SP).
 
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