has pokemon "jumped the shark"?

AmishEskimoNinja

AmishEskimoNinja

Hating durant since 11/16/11
Member
For those not familiar with the term, "jumping the shark" happens when a TV show does something "cool" or "fantastic" that is utterly ridiculous just to get attention. It marks the point at which the show has completely left its original purpose, and typically signals that the end is near.

I think a similar phenomenon effects collectible games. Typically as people start to lose interest, the game explodes with new ridiculousness powerful cards. Each set is more powerful than the last. Also, there are typically alternate win conditions. Eventually the "I win" card results. IMO pokemon is showing these signs. Lost world is a cheap, cheesy way to win that is completely not the point of the game. Furthermore, you could also win with Dialga/Palkia Legend by filling up your your opponent's prizes. Finally, the power creep of cards like groundon/Kyogre legend is ridiculous. If you're unfortunate enough to have 3 energy on the top five cards of your deck, that's pretty much game over. Yes, they're slow. Yes, machamp wants to take them out to dinner. But that's not the point.

Don't get me wrong, I love pokemon. Its fan base is huge, I don't see it disappearing soon, but I'm worried about where we're headed. Nothing good comes out of unrestrained power creep...
 
Lost zone kinda fails to tomb. The others are a bit gimmicky IMO. Sure, they are broken, but still not practical. Steelix SF can Serebii it's way through any deck, but it's not meta because it requires luck, and is inconsistant.
 
Juliacoolo said:
Lost zone kinda fails to tomb. The others are a bit gimmicky IMO. Sure, they are broken, but still not practical. Steelix SF can Serebii it's way through any deck, but it's not meta because it requires luck, and is inconsistant.
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I'm confused. Why does lost zone fail to spiritomb? And what does steelix have to do with anything? Did you mean SF gyarados? yes, you can luck sack and get their whole deck, but it isn't nearly as likely as knocking out someone's whole bench with Groundon/Kyogre.
 
^He meant Steelix. It flips a coin until you get tails and does 100 damage for each heads.
 
^I don't remember anything cheesy from that era. Is there something specific you're referring to? E-reader stuff?

Meaty said:
^He meant Steelix. It flips a coin until you get tails and does 100 damage for each heads.
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There's a lot of stuff that can do a lot more damage, a lot more predictably. They could make a card that just knocked out the opponent's pokemon for all I care. The problem is this other stuff that lets you win other ways.
 
amisheskimoninja said:
Lost world is a cheap, cheesy way to win that is completely not the point of the game.
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And that is why TPCi and TPCL are banning it.
 
Your kidding me right. You think that pokemon is coming to an end because there are new and different cards coming to tcg? It's because they want to keep things fresh in the tcg and not stale.
 
piplup234 said:
And that is why TPCi and TPCL are banning it.
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It could happen, and I wouldn't blame them. I put together a gengar prime deck and it is really cheap. I seriously almost always win by turn 5.
 
GHJamesGH said:
It could happen, and I wouldn't blame them. I put together a gengar prime deck and it is really cheap. I seriously almost always win by turn 5.
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IKR, and this isn't just a theory of mine, it is a fact. I know a high up judge that said that they are going to ban it.
 
piplup234 said:
IKR, and this isn't just a theory of mine, it is a fact. I know a high up judge that said that they are going to ban it.
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They will more than likely wait untill after release in the US that way insuring more profit.
 
bigpokex said:
They will more than likely wait untill after release in the US that way insuring more profit.
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Yeah, thats going to make me really mad. If they don't end up banning lost world, getting gengar prime is going to be like getting Lux x. If they do ban it, I'm going to have wasted money on buying them.
 
bigpokex said:
Your kidding me right. You think that pokemon is coming to an end because there are new and different cards coming to tcg? It's because they want to keep things fresh in the tcg and not stale.
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I'm just saying I've seen it happen in a lot of other games.

bigpokex said:
They will more than likely wait untill after release in the US that way insuring more profit.
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Or they could wait to see if it really does ruin the metagame first. That seems like a logical reason to wait.

Man I hope they really do ban it. I think most of the lost zone cards will still be really effective and playable even without lost world.
 
After using my Gengar Prime deck for a few games, I realized that Lost World is not actually the cheap card. The card that makes the deck so cheap is hunter. You can make them pick up one of their pokemon then send it to the lost zone, and you can pick up your uxie every turn and use set-up. Its insane.
 
amisheskimoninja said:
For those not familiar with the term, "jumping the shark" happens when a TV show does something "cool" or "fantastic" that is utterly ridiculous just to get attention. It marks the point at which the show has completely left its original purpose, and typically signals that the end is near.

I think a similar phenomenon effects collectible games. Typically as people start to lose interest, the game explodes with new ridiculousness powerful cards. Each set is more powerful than the last. Also, there are typically alternate win conditions. Eventually the "I win" card results. IMO pokemon is showing these signs. Lost world is a cheap, cheesy way to win that is completely not the point of the game. Furthermore, you could also win with Dialga/Palkia Legend by filling up your your opponent's prizes. Finally, the power creep of cards like groundon/Kyogre legend is ridiculous. If you're unfortunate enough to have 3 energy on the top five cards of your deck, that's pretty much game over. Yes, they're slow. Yes, machamp wants to take them out to dinner. But that's not the point.

Don't get me wrong, I love pokemon. Its fan base is huge, I don't see it disappearing soon, but I'm worried about where we're headed. Nothing good comes out of unrestrained power creep...
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I agree with you on the Lost World part, but, honestly, wait for a ruling on D/P Legend. If the ruling is you can make your opponent have more than 6 prizes, then yeah, I'd call it broken. If not, then it's pretty much just a gimmick card that will rarely see play.
 
GHJamesGH said:
After using my Gengar Prime deck for a few games, I realized that Lost World is not actually the cheap card. The card that makes the deck so cheap is hunter. You can make them pick up one of their pokemon then send it to the lost zone, and you can pick up your uxie every turn and use set-up. Its insane.
Click to expand...

Wow. I actually hadn't made that realization. That IS nasty.
 
I have been mostly trying to avoid this fact, because I see a really great combo with D/PL (D/PL+Heatran Lv.X) but in the back of my mind, I know that Pokemon has been jumping the shark. Even though Machamp and Gengar came before it, It all started with Power Spray. It could be played during your opponents turn, like a trap card in Yu-Gi-Oh. (I can't believe I said it) Here's a list of all the cards I see are "jumping the shark":

Power Spray (Play it during your opponents turn)
Palkia & Dialga Legend (Return opponents Pokemon to their hand and give them two more prize cards)
Lost World (Fast way to win)
Jumpluff (Mass Attack!)
Spiritomb/Vileplume (Trainer lock)
Entei & Raikou Legend (When it goes into play, GG)
Gengar Prime/Lv.X (All K.O.ed Pokemon are Lost Zoned, Lost zone Pokemon from your opponents hand, Level Down opponents Pokemon)
Machamp (Take Out!)
Gengar (Fainting Spell)
Poke Turn (A no-risk way to return SP's to your hand)
Hunter (A no-risk way to return your and your opponents Pokemon to their hand)
 
I agree. Pokemon is definitely jumping the Sharpedo. Lost World is extremely lame. It's Pokemon's Exodia, and it should be banned! The Lost Zone was fine until we start getting sets completely based around a way that can win sure-handedly. Palkia and Dialga is as cheap as all get-out, and there definitely needs to be an errata on that wording. There's way too much "awesomeness" coming out, and soon, there'll just be a lack of creativity. It's going to be a battle to see who can stall out their opponent or pull out Gengar Prime or whatever...ugh. Can't we bring the DX-DP format back? Seriously, it was much better then...
 
I completely agree. I really hope Dialga and Palkia LEGEND gets banned. That card will take the fun out of the game and make it tougher than it already is. (Are cards able to get banned anyways??)
 
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