Best Deck Post-DE (CMT, Zek, Dark?)

Trexroarr

Trexroarr

Aspiring Trainer
Member
I figured a thread like this would be a good idea for those people who are preparing for Nationals. I know I am.

So what do you all think will be the top deck(s) once Dark Explorers is released in two weeks? I'm guessing CMT and ZekEels will still be up there of course, but what about this new Dark Toolbox deck which I keep on hearing a lot about? Think it will pass CMT as the top deck?
 
It will pretty much stay the same I think. Zekeels will be top deck followed by CMT.

1. ZekEels - Top deck, Fast, energy returns, allows for many options while playing, and overall consistency, gets Raikou EX tech if desired/ Tornadus Ex for terrakion counter

2. CMT - superfast with right deck comp, decent against everything sans durant, gets tornadus ex for more donks

3. Dark.dec - fast with appropriate setup,energy exceleration , free retreat is nice, but main attackers are stage 1 and lack large health pools.
 
Trexroarr said:
Think it will pass CMT as the top deck?
Click to expand...

Since when is CMT the top deck? How many Regionals did it win? ZekEels is, in my opinion, the best deck because it has performed the best recently.

Anyways, both CMT and ZekEels gain consistency and techs with Dark Explorers. Dark.dec is very strong and quick also, and will destroy ZekEels and CMT when they get bad starts as it is incredibly consistent.
 
I've been having some trouble fitting everything into a Dark.dec build that remains consistent and powerful.

So I think Zekeels will stay the BDIF because Dark Toolbox has space issues and Stage one attackers.
 
I think this is how it would go:
Terrakion>Zekeels
Terrakion>Zoroark
CMT>Terrakion
Zoroark>CMT
Zekeels>CMT
Zekeels>Zoroark
1. Terrakion
2. Zekeels
3. CMT
4.. Zoroark
 
iisnumber12 said:
I think this is how it would go:
Terrakion>Zekeels
Terrakion>Zoroark
CMT>Terrakion
Zoroark>CMT
Zekeels>CMT
Zekeels>Zoroark
1. Terrakion
2. Zekeels
3. CMT
4.. Zoroark
Click to expand...

I'll feel free to quote my earlier post.

Blui is saying that Terrakion will be the BDIF (because it counters zeels and dark) but, it can't be because people will just stop playing the decks it counters and then it would be bad.
Click to expand...
 
Ok, I think:
1. ZekEels (can easily tech in Tornadus/EX to make its Terrakion Matchup better. Its just so fast and deadly.
2. Terrakion (It can beat nearly everything)
3. MTC (Incredibly fast and has some late game problems IMO, but overall its an awesome deck
4. Zoroark (Pretty much has consistency problems. Stage 1's each turn? Not in a format ruled by basics. But, It is still great)
 
In my opinion, Dark decks are really overrated. The engine that they have printed for dark type Pokémon is amazing, and probably very fun to play. That being said, I don't feel that there is a strong enough dark type Pokémon for these Dark variants to earn a spot as a top tiered deck. Absol Prime and Zoroark Black and White are the best options in my opinion. I'm not saying that these deck will be bad, but they aren't going to live up to the hype. I figure they will be at about the same level that Straight Terrakion is at now. Expect Zekrom Eels to continue being the best deck in the format; well, at least the deck that takes the most win simply because of how many people play it. It definitely isn't the best deck in the format, but with such a large player based, it is bound to take home the most wins. Terrakion is going to gain a lot more of an edge. Dark decks will see play, no matter if they are good or not. Terrakion will benefit from that.
 
iisnumber12 said:
Not really. Terrakion isn't a counter deck any more. It can beat almost anything.
Click to expand...

It loses to anything that isn't black or yellow, and even they can beat it...
 
What about EX google? I think Groudon gives it a lot more material.

Or is that deck too slow now?

Anyway...
Let's say the six decks are
Terrakion
Zeels
Celebi/Mewtwo variants
Durant
Zoroark
and Darkrai

Terrakion 70/30 Zeels
Terrakion 35/65 CM
Terrakion 55/45 Durant
Terrakion 70/30 Darkrai
Terrakion 80/20 Zoroark
Total
70+70+35+55+80
310

Zeels 30/70 Terrakion
Zeels 45/55 Darkrai
Zeels 70/30 CM
Zeels 85/15 Durant
Zeels 60/40 Zoroark
Total: 30+45+70+85+60
290

Darkrai 30/70 Terrakion
Darkrai 55/45 Zeels
Darkrai 60/40 CM
Darkrai 45/55 Zoroark
Darkrai 60/40 Durant
Total: 30+55+60+45+60
250

CM 65/35 Terrakion
CM 30/70 Zeels
CM 40/60 Darkrai
CM 30/70 Durant
CM 45/55 Zoroark
Total: 65+30+40+30+45
210

Durant 45/55 Terrakion
Durant 15/85 Zeels
Durant 40/60 Darkrai
Durant 70/30 CM
Durant 25/75 Zoroark
Total: 45+15+40+70+25
195

Zoroark 20/80 Terrakion
Zoroark 40/60 Zeels
Zoroark 55/45 Darkrai
Zoroark 55/45 CM
Zoroark 75/25 Durant
Total: 20+40+55+55+75
245

Although i probably got the matchups wrong you have this as a list:
1. Terrakion
2. Zeels
3. Darkrai
4. Zoroark
5. CM
6. Durant

[/sand=blargh257] ~ Vulpix Yolk
 
Battle Roads will be a good testing grounds for Dark toolbox variants. During that period we'll see if it has what it takes to compete in our current meta, or anything else in Dark Explorers for that matter.

I'm not really a fan of Zoroark DE. Despite it being one of the better cards coming from the next set, it's a stage 1 with 100 HP - which is an easy damage cap to accomplish for alot of decks - that needs a bench full of dark pokemon to to be able to reach its full potential, but you can still get away with 3/4 {D} pokemon on the bench as long as Darkness Claw is attached to it.. I'm basing this all on theory but considering how the meta has shifted since Next Destinies it's not too far from the truth. Darkrai EX should be the main attacking focus of the deck to be honest. Considering the tools it has access to and the superior HP is over Zoroark, gives it some decent survivability, plus basing a deck around that allows you to add different types to be able to fend off anything that threatens the deck, but of course, you can only tech so much until you start to decrease consistency. A T2 Darkrai EX is alot more threatening than a T2 Zoroark IMO considering it also hits the bench. However Dark Patch is limited to {D} pokemon (thank goodness) so the deck is limited in terms of energy accel so Shaymin UL might become a necessity if techs are needed.

Saying all that might be a bit hollow considering i have to yet to test Zoroark DE, however i doubt it will make Zekeel see any less play and might actually make Landorus/Terrakion decks see more play to take advantage of all the {F} weakness. I wouldn't be too surpirsed if Donphan Prime variants take a couple of BRs. Durant will contnue to see play as Heatmor is a horrible tech. (What deck that see's play honestly has serious problems against Durant?) CMT decks may just drop the "M" in favour of some more suitable techs just to play it safe.

Nationals is going to be interesting.
 
RogueChomp said:
4. Zoroark (Pretty much has consistency problems. Stage 1's each turn? Not in a format ruled by basics. But, It is still great)
Click to expand...

Why is that? Zorua has an attack that evolves it to Zoroark (from the deck) for 1 Darkness energy. If the opponent can't knock it out right there (which they'd need a Mewtwo with 5 energy [because of resistance], Tornadus and 2 PlusPower, or something else that does 100 damage on T1 or T2 [which, realistically, is not much at all in this format]), then you've got an attacker primed and ready to go on your very next turn. From there, Pokemon Collector, Level Ball, and even Ultra Ball (which pairs very well with the Dark Patch) can easily fill up the bench and help you evolve behind an attacking Zoroark. Pair that with Special Dark, Darkness Claw, and Pluspower, and I don't see how you think there are really any problems with this deck.

Darkrai gives everything free retreat, so even if you start with something like Terrakion (which isn't really needed, just an example), you can use the Dark Patch in conjunction with like Ultra Ball to still get the Zorua active and attacking on Turn 1.

And, in the above scenario, if a Tornadus just did 80 to a Zoroark, attach another Darkness energy and it can KO a Mewtwo with a 10 damage help (PP, Dark Claw). Once you evolve to Zoroark, you discourage anything short of an OHKO. So, if your opponent had a Pluspower in hand, and they had to search for the other one with a supporter, they might just hold off on playing it on the chance that they don't get the other one and the OHKO.

Either way, Zoroark is not a threat that should be taken lightly, and will certainly at least make a splash in the Battle Roads scene.
 
I'm suprised by how much terrakion love is being thrown around here. Terrakion is going to be a near autoloss against a good player running Tornadus Ex, Eviolite, and a revive/superrod/ssu. 4hko is not going to cut it. Especially when a good player will catch exp.shared terrakions without energy.
 
ESP said:
Since when is CMT the top deck? How many Regionals did it win? ZekEels is, in my opinion, the best deck because it has performed the best recently.

Anyways, both CMT and ZekEels gain consistency and techs with Dark Explorers. Dark.dec is very strong and quick also, and will destroy ZekEels and CMT when they get bad starts as it is incredibly consistent.
Click to expand...

CMT did make top cut more. :p
 
cf11 said:
CMT did make top cut more. :p
Click to expand...

You should go into a tournament with the mindset of winning, not just making cut. Zekrom Eels is clearly the better deck, and even if less people used it or not as many good players used it, it still won 8/9 Regionals, and if that's not the showing of a BDIF I don't know what is.
 
There is no BDIF. It is a combo of Rogues and Zekeels v. CMT. Neither is better, but Zekeels is more popular so it should have more places in cut.
 
Just because it is more popular does not mean that it should take 7 out of the 8 Regionals. CMT didn't even take the last one, Durant did.
 
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