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Standard Alolan Ninetales GX

Welp, looks like I was proved wrong on a ruling again. I don't see how the ruling makes any sense, but apparently what the card says, it doesn't mean. Espeon-EX does NOT devolve the Water Duplicates Frogadiers. And considering that I won a League Challenge based on an incorrect ruling, this is sad for me
 
From the Compendium.
"Miraculous Shine (Espeon EX - BREAKpoint) Q. If a Frogadier is in play by itself from the "Water Duplicates" attack, will Espeon-EX's "Miraculous Shine" attack return it to its player's hand?
A. No. In this case, Frogadier is in play as an Unevolved Stage 1, so there is no evolution to return to the hand. (BREAKpoint FAQ; Feb 11, 2016 TPCi Rules Team)"
 
Kennu said:
From the Compendium.
"Miraculous Shine (Espeon EX - BREAKpoint) Q. If a Frogadier is in play by itself from the "Water Duplicates" attack, will Espeon-EX's "Miraculous Shine" attack return it to its player's hand?
A. No. In this case, Frogadier is in play as an Unevolved Stage 1, so there is no evolution to return to the hand. (BREAKpoint FAQ; Feb 11, 2016 TPCi Rules Team)"
Click to expand...

Yeah, it would've been cool if it could, but I found a couple similar cases like this, one being Talonflame (of course played when setting up) which I'll leave the link below, and Archie's Ace in the Hole, which I found on reddit where it was talking about a Stage 2 Blastoise. Sadly, both agree that they do not count as "evolved" pokemon due to the player having not actually performed the action of evolving the pokemon. Who knew?

http://www.pokebeach.com/forums/threads/espeon-ex-devolve-attack-on-talonflame.138639/

I get what gumball means though when he says it's a bit saddening :(
 
gumball51321 said:
Espeon-EX is a much better counter to Greninja than the Giratina. If you get it out before they get a single Greninja on the field, you win the game. It's also a versatile card overall in this new meta. But good luck getting them, the regular arts shot up to about 13 USD, and the full art sitting at 19 USD.
Click to expand...

I have to disagree with you, I believe the Giratina to be a better counter as it's does it job as it soon as it hits the bench. And Greninja decks can be consistent enough to set up quickly anyway, and you will have to deal 70 damage to each Greninja to devolve them to knock them out, and if any of them are BREAKs, they'll just turn into 130 HP Greninja which just made the attack useless as they can just evolve. Spreading that damage takes way too long and by that point, they would have already set up and knocked out Espeon-EX.

You can also run both in the deck, if you don't play against Greninja or a another deck that uses BREAKs, then you can just Ultra Ball the Giratina away.
 
Sharkrai said:
I actually tried out a Greninja break/A. Ninetales GX deck once for fun and it actually didn't do too bad. Probs would need to edit it heavily because of meta matchups as well as the rotation, but it's still an interesting concept.



Haha, I would love to! I'll send you a pm when I get around to it as the fall semester just started and I'm back and forth trying to get used to it, so my apologies if I send it a bit late.



Just my luck to pull a full art one on tcgo orz haha guess it's expected though considering you can't get quite as many free packs irl ;P



That's a very interesting point. Are there any battle videos out there that have such match ups (whether they do pick up the frogadiers or don't)? I'm kind of interested as to how the battles actually played out in either scenario.
Click to expand...

No worries, Sharkrai, send the PM when you have time to, there's no rush. :)
 
Matthew the Fairy Lover said:
I have to disagree with you, I believe the Giratina to be a better counter as it's does it job as it soon as it hits the bench. And Greninja decks can be consistent enough to set up quickly anyway, and you will have to deal 70 damage to each Greninja to devolve them to knock them out, and if any of them are BREAKs, they'll just turn into 130 HP Greninja which just made the attack useless as they can just evolve. Spreading that damage takes way too long and by that point, they would have already set up and knocked out Espeon-EX.

You can also run both in the deck, if you don't play against Greninja or a another deck that uses BREAKs, then you can just Ultra Ball the Giratina away.
Click to expand...
Don't forget, you're quoting me when I thought Espeon could put lone Frogadiers into their hands. Since that isn't the case, yes, Giratina is a better counter to Frogs
 
I would not suggest running a counter for Greninja BREAK decks. First of all they become worse in this new format because they lose cards like Dive Ball and Ace Trainer. Alolan Ninetales can setup fast and hit hard. If you got off to a good start you should be able to hit for 160 on your second turn. Greninja takes time to setup, so you should be able to plow through them. I have tested this matchup multiple times and Greninja won 1 out of 4 of the times. You probably just had 1 or 2 bad matches. Also here is my Alolan Ninetales deck.

Pokemon: 16

2 Alolan Nintales
3 Alolan Nintales GX
4 Alolan Vulpix
1 Manaphy EX
2 Octillery
2 Remoraid
2 Tapu Lele GX

Trainers: 30

4 Aqua Patch
3 Choice Band
2 Field Blower
4 Ultra Ball
1 Rescue Stretcher

Supporters
3 Guzma
4 Professor Sycamore
4 N
1 Sophocles
2 Mallow
1 Professor Kukui
1 Brigette

Energy: 14
10 Water Energy
4 Double Colorless Energy

I hope this helps.
 
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