Zoroark's Positioning with Laser / Bank?

I

It2Zoroark

Aspiring Trainer
Member
The Zoroark in question is the brutal bash attacker. It is a very powerful attacker if played right and is well position in a metagame with laser/bank. Here is my list that is 26-10 against Blastoise/Keldeo EX, Landorus EX/Garbodor, and Big Basics (Plasma).

2x Zorua (Ascension)
2x Zoroark (Brutal Bash)
(I cut one Zoroark line because I almost never got the third one set up and it always felt clunky with the 3-3 line, I have tested 2-2 and it feels way better and smoother.)
3x Darkrai EX
4x Sableye.

4x N
4x Juniper
3x Skyla
1x Colress
2x Ghetsis
4x HTL
2x VCG
2x Escape Rope
2x Energy Switch
4x Dark Patch
2x Dark Claw
1x Computer Search
3x Ultra Ball
2x Tool Scrapper
2x Bicycle
1x Energy Search

10x Darkness Energy

Any thoughts on Zoroark? He's very powerful with being able to set up on t2 and with laser/bank dark claw he can OHKO any non-eviolited non-resistant 170 hp EX on t2 which is pretty insane and difficult to come back from. I think its a good aggressive attacker.

EDIT: the list has been changed to match the upcoming format.
Changes made
-1-1 Zoroark
-2 Bianca
-2 Enhanced Hammer
-2 Eviolite
-4 Pokemon Catcher
+2 Skyla
+2 Escape Rope
+2 Bicycle
+1 Energy Search
+2 Energy Switch
+2 Ghetsis
+1 Colress

The deck as it is now is so much more consistent than I was before. I played my first tournament with it in Houston last week and went 4-3-2 with the old list. Not great but not bad. So far in testing this destroys TDK, I am literally 12-0 against TDK and all of my wins in the regional were against TDK. What gave me trouble was Virizion Variants. However now the list is doing much better against Virizion because I can get set up faster than before now that there a ton more proactive cards in the deck. ALSO the highlight changes so far - +2 Ghetsis +2 Escape Rope. Rope is insane with darkrai's sniping. I've won 6 games against my buddy's darkrai list because of rope. NOW IMHO, Ghetsis is a must for this deck. Period. Especially if you're going first. This guy is devastating to your opponent and buys you all the time you will ever need to win. Every game that i've played him first turn I've won, if you dont believe me test it yourself this card is sick. Also i am looking for 2 FA Ghetsis and I have a Genesect for trade. Thoughts on the new changes???
 
RE: Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

I'm glad someone else agrees that this deck rocks, I've been playtesting and I have won turn 2 about.. hmm... 5 times our of about 10 games, its great for fast damage!
 
RE: Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

Jorgie said:
I'm glad someone else agrees that this deck rocks, I've been playtesting and I have won turn 2 about.. hmm... 5 times our of about 10 games, its great for fast damage!
Click to expand...

I have been playing this deck since I started playing again in DEX. The deck is a blast to play and essentially pilots itself. I have had very good results with it so far so I am looking forward to taking it to a competitive tournament and hopefully do well and turn down the nay-saying lol BTW whats your list?
 
Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

I can't post the whole list now because I'm at work, but it is very similar to the one posted here...

I know I run:

4 zorua
4 zoroark
3 darkrai ex
3 sableye

This gives you 3 starters that you don't mind starting with if that makes sense... My trainer/supporter line is to fully support getting 5 benched and running ASAP a d be attacking big by turn 2.
 
RE: Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

-2 Eviolite (Not useful anymore really.)

+1 E. Hammer (Improves the Plasma matchup.)
+1 Level Ball (Search out those Zorua's.)
 
RE: Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

First of all, Zoroark rocks! Nice deck. Your match results are also quite impressive against those top decks too. Big props to you. (Since I do run a Landorus EX-Garbodor deck, I do hope some of those losses were from that deck. Lol.)

I believe the Foul Play Zoroark (ND) is still legal since it was later released is a current format set. So, I'd definitely suggest you consider adding at least one of these Poké in order to inflict some potential massive damage. I used this Poké in my Dark Waters deck and I've found it to be very effective. Plus, this Poké would be an advantage in several key match-ups.

Since Zoroark is your primary attacker, I'd suggest maxing out the Zorua count. So, I suggest you consider replacing 1 Sableye for another Zorua. IMHO, Zoroark should also be maxed out too (could replace another Sableye or Darkrai EX).

Secondly, why did you choose not to include Absol? You are essentially planing to attack T2 as your deck is setup now (assume a non-Zorua start); so, you could also incorporate this good too, should you wish.

Lastly, if Brutal Bash only requires a CC energy cost, why no DCEs? Should you have bad start and need to retreat your active, you could effectively power-up Zoroark T2 easily with a DCE.
 
RE: Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

TuxedoBlack said:
First of all, Zoroark rocks! Nice deck. Your match results are also quite impressive against those top decks too. Big props to you. (Since I do run a Landorus EX-Garbodor deck, I do hope some of those losses were from that deck. Lol.)

I believe the Foul Play Zoroark (ND) is still legal since it was later released is a current format set. So, I'd definitely suggest you consider adding at least one of these Poké in order to inflict some potential massive damage. I used this Poké in my Dark Waters deck and I've found it to be very effective. Plus, this Poké would be an advantage in several key match-ups.

Since Zoroark is your primary attacker, I'd suggest maxing out the Zorua count. So, I suggest you consider replacing 1 Sableye for another Zorua. IMHO, Zoroark should also be maxed out too (could replace another Sableye or Darkrai EX).

Secondly, why did you choose not to include Absol? You are essentially planing to attack T2 as your deck is setup now (assume a non-Zorua start); so, you could also incorporate this good too, should you wish.

Lastly, if Brutal Bash only requires a CC energy cost, why no DCEs? Should you have bad start and need to retreat your active, you could effectively power-up Zoroark T2 easily with a DCE.
Click to expand...

These are all great points, and here are the answers.
1. I tested Zoroark (Foul Play) for awhile and while it does do decent damage it just doesn't hit as hard as the brutal bash Zoroark who can T2 OHKO a 170hp EX with Laser/bank and Dark claw.

2. The deck started out with a 4-4 count of Zoroark and It just didn't run that smooth. I would often have a 2-3 Zoroark/Zorua hand and no way to accelerate into the t2 attack and it just slowed me down. So I cut down one of each and now the deck is much smoother and everything flows nicely. The thing about this deck is that it requires an exact precision to get set up. Variance is the deck's biggest weakness, that and Landorus/Garbodor (which is my toughest match up with 5 losses). The 4-3 of Sableye and Darkrai are the back up plan. If I know Zoroark isnt happening this set allows me to abandon that strategy and go for a straight Darkrai set up which works well also.

3. I chose not to include Absol because it relies on the opponent's bench which on t2 is typically vacant meaning that Absol is severly underpowered where Zoroark shines.
Plus that means more pokes in the list and Darkrai is a better attacker late game as well.

4. Again the deck originally had DCE's too lol but they don't compliment anything else in the deck. They can't be Patch'd, they don't activate Dark Cloak, Sableye can't junk hunt, and its not even good to set up Darkrai. So the upside is very low compared to how bad it is in the rest of the deck. I wish I could show you how the deck plays so that it would make more sense. Or if you have the cards try it out yourself.

thanks for the comment =)

Blueinvader said:
-2 Eviolite (Not useful anymore really.)

+1 E. Hammer (Improves the Plasma matchup.)
+1 Level Ball (Search out those Zorua's.)
Click to expand...

Why isn't eviolite good anymore? I do like my Hammer's and I have been tying to fit another in. Level ball is also an interesting option that I will explore. I am more partial to Ultra though as it gets darks in the discard for patching.
 
RE: Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

Eviolite isn't good because it's reactive. Tools like Dark Claw and Bangle are proactive because you get the effect of the Tool immediately, on your turn, so you don't have to worry about getting Scrapper during your opponent's turn to get the extra damage.
 
RE: Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

Serperior said:
Eviolite isn't good because it's reactive. Tools like Dark Claw and Bangle are proactive because you get the effect of the Tool immediately, on your turn, so you don't have to worry about getting Scrapper during your opponent's turn to get the extra damage.
Click to expand...

That's a fair assessment. Eviolite does make Keldeo EX have to find an 8th energy though OHKO a 180 hp EX
 
RE: Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

Here's my decklist. Ultra consistency!

4 Zorua (DE 69)
4 Zoroark (DE 71)
3 Darkrai EX (BWP 46)
3 Sableye (DE 62)


4 Professor Juniper (PF 116)
4 N (NV 101)
2 Bicycle (PS 117)
3 Random Receiver (DE 99)
4 Hypnotoxic Laser (PS 123)
2 Virbank City Gym (PS 126)
4 Pokemon Catcher (EP 95)
4 Dark Patch (DE 93)
2 Dark Claw (DE 92)
4 Ultra Ball (DE 102)
1 Computer Search (BC 137)
2 Enhanced Hammer (DE 94)

10 Darkness Energy (BW 111)
 
RE: Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

Jorgie said:
Here's my decklist. Ultra consistency!

4 Zorua (DE 69)
4 Zoroark (DE 71)
3 Darkrai EX (BWP 46)
3 Sableye (DE 62)


4 Professor Juniper (PF 116)
4 N (NV 101)
2 Bicycle (PS 117)
3 Random Receiver (DE 99)
4 Hypnotoxic Laser (PS 123)
2 Virbank City Gym (PS 126)
4 Pokemon Catcher (EP 95)
4 Dark Patch (DE 93)
2 Dark Claw (DE 92)
4 Ultra Ball (DE 102)
1 Computer Search (BC 137)
2 Enhanced Hammer (DE 94)

10 Darkness Energy (BW 111)
Click to expand...

That's a sweet list. What are your reasons behind not including tool scrapper? Is it because your list is purely proactive as opposed to reactive?
 
Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

Yeah pretty much, I like the enhanced hammers for when I come up against plasma - just junk hunt them and keep discarding energy until my bench is set up. I do want to add one or two in, as last night I came up against garbodor and he was frustrating!! Still managed to win but took a truckload longer than it needed to.

You'll notice I have only 8 supporters, but that's why there is 3 random receivers and they always get me what I need. Thinking of swapping out an N for a Colress. Other than that I feel like its close to the perfect list for me.
 
RE: Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

Gotcha, Yeah Colress can be good sometimes. I took out my Colress and Bianca's and just swapped in Skyla. She is very good in this deck.
 
RE: Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

This has always been a fun, strong / competitive deck that I've enjoyed for awhile. Not top tier, but certainly capable of taking down any deck if it gets flowing. Agree with not using Eviolite, if anything put in Giant Cape to give Zoroark's low 100HP a little bump (the main weakness in this deck). No DCE either, for another reason it doesn't allow the use of Zoroark's 2nd attack which can be brutal if it is attacked but not knocked out. Yes, make room for a Tool Scrapper definitely. I do use a couple of level balls along with 3 Ultra Balls just to help set up faster - want that full bench ASAP. Colress is a yes also for the full bench reason. The problem when deck doesn't work is usually with having to use Ascension too much for evolving, then getting KO'd before getting to attack. If get a couple of evolutions set up on the bench it is hard to beat. I use 4/4 Zoroark, 2 Sableye, 2 Darkrai, 1 Absol (count me as a believer) in my set up.
 
RE: Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

Hmm... Sounds like a really, really awesome idea. However, I'm a bit worried about it's low HP and Fighting weakness. Nonetheless, I'd really like to test it, really badly!
 
RE: Zoroark's positioning with laser/bank??

Interestingly enough, this deck is one that's "not on the radar," but is being run by at least 1 very accomplished player... In discussing this deck at length, I believe that:
  • 3 Brutal Bash Zoroark are needed and 1 Foul Play Zoroark is also needed. Although the BB Zoroark will be used most of the time, the FP Zoroark can 1HKO Blastoise's Black Kyurem. So, the FP Zoroark is very useful is key matchups.
  • IMHO, this is a viable, competitive deck given the 50-minute match time limit for this season. In recent playtesting, I managed to beat 3 different Plasma deck builds within the new match time limit.
  • My Poké line-up of 3/1 Zororak, 4, Zorua, 3 Darkrai EX, 2 Sableye and 2 Absol is quite solid and versatile.
  • 2 Tool Scrapper work well for me.
  • A mix of Dark Claw, Silver Bangle and Ht Laser (not effective in some matchups when opponents used Virizion) works well for me too. A combination of these when applied properly can help inflict massive damage.
 
I am not sure how well this deck is going to be positioned post rule change though. Not being able to ascension on turn 1 will be good enough.
 
I think the new LT set helps this deck quite a bit with the re-release of Energy Switch and Crushing Hammer. Any thoughts yet on how you might incorporate these cards into your deck?
 
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