Theorymon Exercises - Week 4

[Professor Palutena]

I'm late. I'm late for a very important date. Or rather posting this. Sorry everyone.

Today, we will be looking at Arcanine who won last weeks poll with three votes.

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Type: Fire
Stats: 90 HP/110 Attack/80 Defense/100 Sp. Attack/80 Sp.Defense/95 Speed/555 Total
Abilities: Intimidate/Flash Fire/Justified

Notable Moves:
-Extremespeed
-Will-O-Wisp
-Wild Charge
-Close Combat
-Flare Blitz
-Morning Sun
-Crunch
-Flame Charge
-Agility
-Howl

Potential is probably the best word to describe Arcanine. Its stat total is among the highest of the non-legendary Pokemon and it has lots of powerful tools in its moveset. It gets ExtremeSpeed to act as a high powered priority move, Wild Charge and Close Combat to nail its weaknesses, Morning Sun to restore health, Will-O-Wisp to stay bulky and Flare Blitz to hit hard. So what keeps this puppy with potential in the lower tiers?

Well, I think it has to do with Arcanine trying to be a jack of all trades. It wants to be a defensive Fire-type, yet it also wants to have some form of offensive presence and it's able to both, just not very well. 90/80/80 defenses with Stealth Rock weakness and a limited recovery move (Morning Sun has 5PP and is affected by weather). The low physical defense is lessened by Intimidate and Will-O-Wisp but its still not turning Arcanine into a tank.

Its coverage is also fairly lacking. It improved with the additions of Wild Charge and Close Combat, but its still fairly low which makes it predictable. So, how can we improve this dog?

Well, I'd first of all like to suggest Dragon Dance. Arcanine already learns a couple Dragon-type moves so it wouldn't be too far out there. I'd also like to suggest Magic Guard for it because Arcanine is based off of a mythological beast and it would also help it defensively as well as helping it set up Dragon Dance. This would give it somewhat of a niche on Sun teams. Its bulk is decent but it should help Arcanine set up at least one Dragon Dance.

Let's see what you got!

 

[Shadow Scyther]

One word: Drought. It would be an awesome ability on Arcanine because it is bulkier than Ninetales and has all the moves it needs to defeat other weather inducers (CC,Wild Charge, Flare Blitz). Also it would be the only weather started with reliable recovery.

 

[Juliacoolo]

Dropping 15 or 20 sp.A to put 5 in speed and 10-15 in attack could give Arcanine the thumbs up over other physical sun sweepers. CB Arcanine Flare Blitz in the sun could be preferred over Darmantitan with 100 speed and a more solid 125 attack.

 

[PMJ]

Giving Arcanine Drought is a terrible idea. It would make him better, sure, but at what cost? There's a reason GF gave Drought and Drizzle to bad Pokemon. Arcanine's access to a permanent 75% Morning Sun perfectly complements Wild Charge, so any Politoed thinking to come in to hamper Morning Sun is going to wind up getting 2HKOed (assuming Adamant and LO [Jolly isn't even necessary since Adamant Arcanine is faster than Timid Politoed]).

I just don't think it would do anything except make Arcanine (and, by extension, sun team) usage skyrocket, and I don't know if that's what you're looking for in this project.

 

[bacon]

Ability: It's hard to suggest an ability, as Arcanine is already in possesion of two excellent ones in Intimidate and Flash Fire. Rock Head and Reckless would both be very welcome as Arcanine's physical movepool is largely formed by recoil attacks. Magic Guard is good on everything, but Arcanine gets special mention as its susceptability to hazards and recoil makes its HP very precious.

Moves: Arcanine has always wanted Earthquake, although it's less important now with Close Combat and Wild Charge providing ample coverage. Swords Dance with Extreme Speed sounds wonderful on a Pokemon with just the right bulk and speed to use it, and differentiates itself from Infernape by being able to hit Latios, Starmie and friends with powerful neutral priority.

Typing: Oh God it's a crime that such wonderful stats are wasted on a pure Fire type. I think Steel as a secondary typing is the best option. It even gets Flash Fire if you want a physically offensive Heatran. Pity it never got Outrage, a viable Fire/Dragon in standard play would have been swell.

Stats: Move some points from the SpA it's never going to use into the Atk it's going to nuke things with.

 

[One Approved]

Fire/Steel typing would be a plus. Doesn't lose 1/4 health on all the stealth rock's every time. With Flash Fire, it coudl work as a physical Heatran basically, with Flare Blitz and Close Combat as opposed to Fire Blast and Earth Power. Arcanine could also do good mixed with Fire Blast or Flamethrower, and using Close Combat as a backup move for type coverage.

If Arcanine got some kind of recovery move that wasn't trolled by weather, it would be better I think, as well. Recover would be great, since Arcanine would be much more versatile. Even keeping pure fire typing, Recover would still make it completely viable for OU play, I think.

 

[PG24]

Fire/Fighting gives neutral damage to SR and gives CC a STAB. Things like G-Dos and Jellicent won't like taking a Wild Charge, while Slowbro can somewhat take it. Giving it SD and SE lets it sweep and get great coverage. Bumping up the speed to something like 102 would be great to outspeed base 100's and Landorus. Better Recovery never hurts, nor does a bumped up attack.

Ditto what bacon said about Reckless. A +2 Reckless STAB Flare Blitz is nothing to laugh at.

 

[Metalizard]

Pity it never got Outrage, a viable Fire/Dragon in standard play would have been swell.

Enlight me why would a dog (with a few lion traits) be a Dragon-type? Just because it learns Dragon attacks?

Anyway, like some have suggested, since people almost never use it's Sp. Atk, taking about 20 points from its Sp.Atk and put them in the ATK and Speed would be better... Other than that, I don't think Arcanine has many flaws... It's a pretty good Pokémon.

 

[PMJ]

Arcanine is in part based on the mythical lion-dog Shisa. I would imagine that, as dragons are mythical pokemon, giving Arcanine a couple Dragon-type moves is a nod to that.

That is to say, Arcanine learns the moves based on his origins, not the other way around.

 

[bacon]

@ Metalizard: Why not...? It's certainly not Steel looking either but you didn't call that out, lol. I'm confused by your post, this is evidently not a thread where we assign additional typing for flavour reasons.

 

[Metalizard]

^Not that I agree with Steel either... I just talked about the Dragon-type since it's the most unlikely type it would have... I honestly think Arcanine doesn't need to change type or have a secondary type. And...

this is evidently not a thread where we assign additional typing for flavour reasons

That's why I don't really like these type of discussions. People just throw things up in the air even if it doesn't make any sense. Just like those smogon articles about hypothetical re-types...

PMJ, I get why they gave it a couple dragon moves (It's not that I don't like it), but as you said, it's based on a mythical dog-lion... having moves of a type and having the type itself are different things...

 

[PG24]

This isn't a disscusion about if the typing or moves make sense, it's a discussion about what we can do to actually make this a Pokemon more usable. Tbh, a lot of things in Pokemon don't make sense.

 

[Metalizard]

^Ok, sorry, I won't insist on it. Like I said in another topic, I like speculating on how to make a pokémon better but also applying some logic at the same time. It's just the way I think. But I understand what you mean.

 

[Dork Void]

Arcanine really doesn't need very much to be better; its already useful as a physical attacker on sun teams. Up its speed by 6 to outspeed those base 100s (especially Volcarona) and then get its attack to 120-130, cutting primarily special attack in the process. Change it to fighting type to remove SR weakness and give it Close Combat STAB and viola, top-tier threat. It doesn't make for an interesting discussion but Arcanine already has great abilities and movepool so there isn't a lot to discuss.

Also, the poll is causing more people to vote for a specific Pokemon than would otherwise vote for it imo. I think it would be better if all votes had to be posted in the thread, but that's just me (cough cough why is Ludicolo getting any votes cough cough).