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Alt. Format (SUM-LTH) Wait, This Is Viable Now? (Luxray/Alolan Muk)

Discussion in 'PTCG Deck Garage' started by John InCENAroar, Aug 25, 2018.

  1. John InCENAroar Hunting Shiny Terrakion, Apostle of Pickle Brick
    John InCENAroar

    Member

    We've all talked about Luxray already. It's a pretty decent tank that can item lock with some help. which was always playable. Except, this wasn't as easy. Mainly because to use this item lock, you needed a bench space, and the pokemon only had 70 HP, making it really easy to KO. Luckily, we no longer need that bench space.

    Pokemon (18):
    • Shinx [50 HP] (4)
    • Luxio UPR (4)
    • Luxray UPR (3)
    • Tapu Lele GX (2)
    • A. Grimer BUS (2)
    • A. Muk SUM (2)
    • Xurkitree GX (1)
    Trainers (30):
    • Cynthia (4)
    • Guzma (3)
    • Electro Power (2)
    Electric Power – Trainer
    Item

    During this turn, your [L] Pokemon’s attacks do 30 more damage to your opponent’s Active Pokemon.

    You may play as many Item cards as you like during your turn (before your attack).
    • Thunder Mountain Prism Star (1)
    Thunder Mountain Prism Star – Trainer
    Stadium

    You can’t have more than 1 Prism Star card with the same name in your deck. If a Prism Star card would go to the discard pile, put it in the Lost Zone instead.

    The attacks of each player’s [L] Pokemon cost [L] less.

    As long as this Stadium is in play, whenever a player uses an Item or Supporter card from their hand, prevent all effects of those cards done to this Stadium.

    This card stays in play when you play it. Discard this card if another Stadium card comes into play. If another card with the same name is in play, you can’t play this card.
    • Ultra Ball (4)
    • Professor Elm’s Lecture (2)
    Professor Elm’s Lecture – Trainer
    Supporter

    Search your deck for up to 3 Pokemon with 60 HP or less, reveal them, and put them into your hand. Then, shuffle your deck.

    You can only use 1 Supporter card during your turn (before you attack).
    • Crushing Hammer (2)
    • Enhanced Hammer (2)
    • Volkner (3)
    • Tate and Liza (2)
    • Rescue Stretcher (1)
    • Shrine of Punishments (2)
    • Choice Helmet (2)
    Choice Helmet – Trainer
    Item

    Pokemon Tool: Attach a Pokemon Tool to 1 of your Pokemon that doesn’t already have a Pokemon Tool attached to it.

    The Pokemon this card is attached to takes 30 less damage from the attacks of your opponent’s Pokemon-GX and Pokemon-EX.

    You may play as many Item cards as you like during your turn (before your attack).
    Energy (12):
    • Lightning (4)
    • Memory Energy (4)
    Memory Energy – Special Energy

    This card provides [C] Energy.

    The Pokemon this card is attached to can use the attacks of its previous Evolutions (it still needs the necessary Energy to perform the attack).
    • Unit Energy LPM (4)

    Before, we needed Shining Celebi on the bench to use Luxio's Disconnect attack. But now, we don't, because we have Memory Energy. It has the same effect as Time Recall on Celebi, but it fulfills the energy cost of the attack instead of taking a bench space. This is much better. This means that you don't need to Brigitte for this deck to work, but now you instead just need an energy. This, and once it evolves up into Luxray, you only need 1 lightning energy and Thunder Mountain to use the 150 snipe attack, which can be boosted by electro power! It's a lot better than it is now.

    However, there are two problems with facing this deck. Kartana GX, and Buzzwole GX. However, there are solutions to both of these issues. For Kartana, which can remove your memory energy, I play a 2-2 Alolan Muk line to shut off the abilities of all basic pokemon. This works really well with luxray, since it only shuts off Shinx's ability, which is useless after T1 anyway. Muk also helps in the Buzzwole matchup, removing Diancie's ability, which nerfs their damage significantly, especially when combined with Choice Helmet. With choice helmet, Luxray takes 60 less damage from Buzzwole. This means that to do damage for a single energy, they need Diancie prism and Beast Energy to do any damage (remember that Choice Band does not effect Luxray). However, this becomes exponentially more impossible with the inclusion of Muk and E. Hammer.

    The point here is to essentially keep your opponent from playing the game. You use Luxray as a tank and, with a combination of hammers and disconnect, keep your opponent from utilizing most anything from their hand. Though I have not tested this, I expect it to be really good.

    Edit 1:
    • - 2 Crushing Hammer: while good, not as important as something like recovery or draw support.
    • -1 Enhanced hammer: same reasoning as C. Hammer.
    • -1 Choice Helmet: Though this may be a bad exclusion, other elements of the deck needed to be bolstered, so I had to cut 1 of them. I could take out a second E. Hammer for this, but I still want to have enough to guarantee the hammer on Beast Energy when it applies, instead of having my only one prized (yes, I'm positive this scenario will happen to me every applicable game.)
    • -2 Electro Power: I figured that I wouldn't need to hit the 180 with Luxray as often if it meant adding what @Rusery called a "Plan B", which I did.

    • +2 Shrine of Punishment: as part of the "plan B", or maybe even Plan C, I use this to whittle for a bit more on turns that I Disconnect, and it'll improve odds of taking a knockout with the snipe if I either invest without TMPS or if I can play into TMPS the turn I need to.
    • +1 Rescue Stretcher: An almost unanimous call-out, I need recovery. This is my recovery.
    • +2 Tate and Liza: Adds supplemental draw aside from the core Volkner/Cynthia, and provides an alternative swith-out option after my muk gets dragged out from a stall tactic.
    • +1 Xurk GX: the other element of the secondary plan, this is a wall that defends against anything that isn't Rayquaza, pretty much. It gives me a stall GX attack if I don't have the capacity to use Tapu Cure GX, and, as I said in my reply, can sometimes win me games all by itself.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2018


  2. Rusery Ethical Vegan Pokemaster
    Rusery

    Member

    Looks clean and i like that. No muddy strats, pretty straight forward, but its still plagued by a few issues.

    1) New Prism stadiums can't be blown, but can be replaced. Issue here is the lost zone. Its best to expect youll get one attack off with the stadium and itll be back to 2L1C if removed.
    2) Once your stadium is removed (if it isnt, GG) you'll be discarding L or Unit without any way to get it back (point #3). 150-180 with the item isn't going to 1hKO a lot of new stuff.
    3) I like the stalls, but you only have Cynthia and Volkner for draw in the deck, and you're running 4x ultra ball with nothing to bring any cards back.
    4) 8/12 is special energy. While not overly an issue, its hard to swing back from a losing position if you're hammered or something else.
    5) No plan B, but to keep trying for Luxray. I was watching worlds, and while it was overly stale as usual, i saw lots of plan B. IE using, Trashalanche Garbo, Zoroark, Xurkitree shenanigans if something doesn't go well or you can't use your main strat. We all know things mostly don't go our way with 60 card deck bases.

    Suggestions:

    Plan B. Xurkitree-GX and his babe counterpart are great cards for this deck. The former has a stalling GX attack and main attack and ofc works with all the lightning support. The latter has a stalling confusion move for a single L and a swing move that paralyzes.

    Super Rod, Rescue Stretcher, Timer Ball, Tapu-lele-GX, Pal Pad, Max Potion.

    Basically, you need options and this deck is cut and dry. Rods to get energy back, Pal Pads to get your limited supporter base back, Tapu because what if you have no Elm or need a Guzma for the win? Timer ball because Ultra isn't great without some kind of discard retrieval. Max potion because i think youll be taking some severe beatings trying to get this entire thing set up unscathed.

    Anyhow, you can tell from when i write this much shit, i love the deck and i care to see it grow into something. Lets brainstorm on this.
     
  3. kgamer7 Aspiring Trainer
    kgamer7

    Member

    This deck sounds super interesting, i'm just curious why you want to play unit energy instead of 4 more lighting, also i think the deck could use a few more draw supporters and some shrines for when they replace your thunder mountain.
     
  4. The Binder Guy Aspiring Trainer
    The Binder Guy

    Member

    The deck is interesting in theory but I'm really worried about Alolan Muk, Power of Alchemy is a really good Ability (albeit not as good as Garbotoxin) but it suffers due to it being on a Pokemon with a whopping 4-Energy Retreat Cost in a format with no Float Stone.

    That said, there are some ways to get around it, having a backup Alolan Grimer on the Bench and then using Acerola on Alolan Muk (if your opponent hasn't OHKO'd it already) is one way to get around it. Another is having both an Alolan Grimer on the Bench and a Rescue Stretcher in your hand if they do OHKO it.
     
  5. John InCENAroar Hunting Shiny Terrakion, Apostle of Pickle Brick
    John InCENAroar

    Member

    Alright, wow. Thanks a lot for your imput guys. Here's my response:

    To @The Binder Guy: I am aware that alolan muk is a fat piece of lard. That being said, I should probably add in some recovery, as you suggest. I was in the mindset of Shuckle GX when I made this, which is why the hammer count is high and could probably be lowered.

    To @kgamer7: I play Unit Energy for the purpose of using Lele's GX attack in a pinch, since the luxray has free retreat and I can completely heal two of them without needing to discard memory energy ala Max Potion. I am liking the Shrine idea though.

    And Finally, to @Rusery (I cannot stress how much I appreciate your input in particular): To start off, I must stress how much I do not want max potion in this deck. Since the way I am able to use disconnect is based upon an energy attachment, Max Potion would cripple the deck like no tommorow, making the options for using Disconnect even more limited than they are already. This is also post-rotation, so no Rod. I did already touch on the point of adding a stretcher, so that part is covered. When I was making this deck, my main thought was "How do I lock people down even more than items?" While Xurk could be a good addition, and it may very well be one, I prefered the Muk in my initial thought because pretty much every deck has at least one card with an ability in it, while special energy is less common (but only slightly. I'd prefer to not have that as my out against something like Ray GX though). Don't think I'm underselling special energy, since I do actually play a Xurk GX in my Beast Box deck and it has literally won me games (mainly against ZoroCargo) because my opponent couldn't find a Guzma into KO combo fast/often enough to win. It's just that Lele, who's ability is almost broken, is seen in every deck, but is shut off by Muk. I suppose I could try and find room for tate and liza or something to not only help with a stuk muk, but also provide decent shuffle draw, and the timer balls, since looking now I am relying a bit too much on getting a T1 Elm.

    In short, the edit will be on the main post soon. Thanks again to all for their two cents.
     
  6. Rusery Ethical Vegan Pokemaster
    Rusery

    Member

    I guess my suggesting Max Potion really overlooked the strict use of Disconnect. Using the potion would scrap your Memory Energy, and thats counter intuitive to your intended use for the set up. I am still a strong advocate of denying prize cards, as its won me countless games. With that said, Acerola might help, or Super Scoop Up. I guess it all depends on how much effort you're putting into getting Luxray online and how much you want to invest in stalling.

    As for Muk, i agree that hes going to see way more play SM-on and hes a fine choice for a 2-2. @18 pokemon as well you don't really want to push higher to be adding in anything else. Not to mention you've got Luxray you need to focus on pretty much 99% of the time here.

    List is looking solid as-is, i will continue to think about this one here for some time.
     

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