Discussion Gardevoir GX - Options for Quicker Evolution

[Duo]

Hello everyone. I'm fairly new to the Pokemon TCG and decided I would like to get involved with competitive level play starting with the September 1st rotation.

I've been contemplating a Gardevoir GX deck as one of my options as I do really like the Pokemon and it seems to be particularly effective moving forwards. I apologize if a discussion like this has already happened a while back, but if it has happened I would appreciate a link to an older thread.

The main thing I'm stuck on right now is how to build the...I guess "evolution engine," if you will (sorry I came from YuGiOh), for Gardevoir GX. I believe we have a few options.

Diancie (BUS) - The new Diance coming out in BUS seems to be pretty useful, but it seems to work against rare candy a little bit. If I'm not mistaken, a handful of people prefer a 4-2-3 line of Gardevoir GX using 4 rare candies to bypass the Kirlia step, also letting you get into Gallade as well. My issue with Diancie is that if you add it into the deck, it means you need that Kirlia intermediate step to either use Diance for Ralts to Kirlia or Kirlia to Gardevoir GX/Gallade, and drawing rare candies with Kirlias on the board is more like drawing expired candies.

At the same time, I think Diancie introduces a very interesting mechanic. If you have a Ralts and a Kirlia on the field and a rare candy in hand, because you have Kirlia, you can search Gardevoir GX and still use rare candy to accelerate a Ralts to Gardevoir GX. I am currently operating under the assumption that Diancie only searches for the next direct evolution, so if you only have Ralts on the table you can't search for Gardevoir GX or Gallade since they don't evolve directly from Ralts.

Olivia (BUS) - I was actually thinking running 1 or 2 Olivia also coming out in BUS would be another consideration for working with the rare candy route of evolving to Gardevoir GX. Basically whenever you see a Ralts and a Rare Candy, you'd be gunning for Olivia to get your Gardevoir GX. She can also grab your Tapu Lele GX for next turn supporter in case you draw her before you draw Tapu Lele. I kind of think Olivia falls a bit short since she can only search for GX, but the opportunity is there.

Alolan Vulpix - Honestly, with Beacon I think Alolan Vulpix is probably the best for Gardevoir GX evolution. You can grab any of your missing evolutions since Beacon has no restrictions like Diancie or Olivia, and requires no energy. My issue with Alolan Vulpix is that I'm not sure I like the concept of occupying the bench with a 60 HP basic becomes worth while in the long run. I feel like if you don't see Alolan Vulpix basically within the first 2 or 3 turns, your opponent is going to have a way to KO it very easily, and you lose a prize to get your Gardy cards, and at the very least becomes kind of dead weight on the bench after you search for what you need. It doesn't really have continuity. Diancie has at least has 30 more HP and a fairy-wide heal to use outside of her searching ability, and her 1 energy cost for Sparkling Prayer doesn't really matter when you would want to attach 1 fairy energy on her anyway for Fairy Garden.

So, long story short, I'm curious how people are planning to make evolution consistent for Gardy GX. Would love to hear other people's thoughts.

 

[Treydog]

I'm planning to play 1-2 alolan vulpix as well as 4 rare candies. I like this because you can grab kirlia and/or gardevoir gx's. Your hand could get n'ed away but I still think the vulpix is the best option.

 

[A Dragon of Destiny]

I think Olivia is interesting and potentially useful but Alolan Vulpix would be better since you can get both the Gardevoir GX and Kirlia if needed. I could see Diancie being useful but the Vulpix is still probably the better option.

 

[Kietharr]

Diancie isn't that good of a card, 2 Vulpix+1 Olivia+1 Skyla, 3 rare candies and a 4-2-3 line imo.

I like Olivia because it helps negate some of the tradeoff for ultra balling for an evolution instead of a consistency card. Lele > Olivia seems kind of stupid but it gives you your evolution and another Lele to use the next turn to keep your game moving. It's a good card for decks where you need a lot of particular pieces in your hand at the same time (same with Skyla).

 

[JDA]

Olivia is a great option for sure. Gardevoir GX is also excellent but simply requires what I'd like to call 'a set up wall'.
To me the set up isn't going to be much faster as it is now. You run your Proffs, N, Ultras and you've got a good baseline engine for anything. In addition running Rare Candies is a good choice if your solely relying on Gardevoir GX and offcourse Olivia can be the replacement of the current VS Seeker. Provided you run more GX's with it offcourse.

So from my perspective in order to gain time I'd consider the following Pokemon as what I'd like to call a set up wall. I have no idea if there is another name for that in Pokemon TCG but it boils down to having a Pokemon active as a starter (so youll run 4 of them at minimum) and thus have an ideal way to gain some time while doing something and preparing the bench for your Stage 2 pokemon.

- Diancy from BUS seems like a great choice here, you can also consider running it with an Octillery line to ensure your drawing engine is quick to go online, which then will speed up Gardevoir etc.
- Eevee+Sylveon GX, ideal for reasons with Olivia and the set up again that Eevee SUM allows for.
- Talonflame STS, it's a bit of an all in but can work out well enough. The downside offcourse is that it's actually eating up a lot of basic slots if you want it to be a consistent part of your deck set up.
- Xerneas and Xerneas BREAK STS, improving set ups and increasing set up speed in form of energies. In addition also a filter and a non-EX/GX.
- Brigette.

Lastly offcourse you have the whole slew of Tauros GX, Drampa GX, Oranguru etc that can also assist practically any engine but I personally think Xerneas is the 'set up wall' you should include in your deck. It's easy to have it be functional, has a large ammount of HP and isn't completely useless to function as a 'recover' either (where your opponent will KO it but you then gain another turn or two to set up).

The prime advantage gained here is that the moment you can filter your deck of energies you increase the chance of drawing into relevant Trainers and Pokemon. Give it a go! A 4-2 of Xerneas and Xerneas BREAK seems like a great set up option to me. You wont always have it but when you do all that can really happen is that at some point your 1 prize behind but your bench is ready to go.

Cheers,

 

[Rezolution]

I feel Diance is the way to go. You Brigette turn one to get your raltz on the field, then you can search and evolve with diance into kirlia. And even if you go first and you get Kirlia out turn 2, you can still get Gardivoir GX's with Diance, making it more consistant.

 

[ozzie347]

Diancie isn't that good of a card, 2 Vulpix+1 Olivia+1 Skyla, 3 rare candies and a 4-2-3 line imo.

The benefit that Diancie offers is that it evolves the pokemon immediately. You're not gonna have them get Nd away before you get to play them. It's more like how talonflame fits into Greninja. If you go second, getting a Diancie start (or getting it active) lets you still get T2 Garde and not fall behind. I'd still play RC in a 4-3-3/1(Gallade) even with Diancie. It's just really good at consistently getting you going if you start it.

 

[JDA]

The only issue I have with BUS Diancie is that it stops being good after the first couple of turns. Which is why I personally like Xerneas more. It has that drastic 130 HP and a Break that is nothing to ignore, especially not in combination with what Gardevoir GX will do eventually. It doesnt speed up the bench but it does give time.

 

[Duo]

The only issue I have with BUS Diancie is that it stops being good after the first couple of turns. Which is why I personally like Xerneas more. It has that drastic 130 HP and a Break that is nothing to ignore, especially not in combination with what Gardevoir GX will do eventually. It doesnt speed up the bench but it does give time.

Thanks for bringing up Xerneas. I actually did not research that as an option and was unaware that it was a thing.

My only issue with Xerneas is that if you don't have access to your Gardevoir GX's then the boosted set up sort of hits a wall, in which case I guess Xerneas BREAK becomes your primary attacker instead. Do you run a 4-2 line yourself? If anything Xerneas seems like a good 1 of to give Gardevoir GX 3 ways to charge up energy in one turn, then Guzma on the next, but I'm not so sure about a full line of them unless Gardy GX is taking 2nd seat in a deck like that.

For the time being I've personally settled on the Alolan Vulpix, but that's far from a final decision.

 

[Ecko9i6]

Thanks for bringing up Xerneas. I actually did not research that as an option and was unaware that it was a thing.

My only issue with Xerneas is that if you don't have access to your Gardevoir GX's then the boosted set up sort of hits a wall, in which case I guess Xerneas BREAK becomes your primary attacker instead. Do you run a 4-2 line yourself? If anything Xerneas seems like a good 1 of to give Gardevoir GX 3 ways to charge up energy in one turn, then Guzma on the next, but I'm not so sure about a full line of them unless Gardy GX is taking 2nd seat in a deck like that.

For the time being I've personally settled on the Alolan Vulpix, but that's far from a final decision.

Have you considered using Wally? This would give you Gardevoir GX either turn 1 or turn 2 if you have Diancie in play. You would wally your Ralts into Kirlia (which Wally allows you to do since you can evolve on first turn) and then Diancie into Gardevoir. If you go first, you'd have to wait until your next turn, but at least you would have Kirlia already set up. If you go second, you will have Gardevoir GX ready to go on your bench.

 

[JDA]

Thanks for bringing up Xerneas. I actually did not research that as an option and was unaware that it was a thing.

My only issue with Xerneas is that if you don't have access to your Gardevoir GX's then the boosted set up sort of hits a wall, in which case I guess Xerneas BREAK becomes your primary attacker instead. Do you run a 4-2 line yourself? If anything Xerneas seems like a good 1 of to give Gardevoir GX 3 ways to charge up energy in one turn, then Guzma on the next, but I'm not so sure about a full line of them unless Gardy GX is taking 2nd seat in a deck like that.

For the time being I've personally settled on the Alolan Vulpix, but that's far from a final decision.

No woories afaik its not a thing yet, the Kaiwe discussion of two weeks ago is also now finally comming into fruition.

The idea of running a 4-2 indeed is to not really end up in that situation where you have no bench or if so at least have another turn to figure out where you can go with the deck. It can be a fun one as a one off but in my experience good Stage 2 decks need these type of consistent walls to get anywhere. To the point where very unconventional Talonflames show up in Greninja decks and from my perspective Xerneas is actually better as it for this deck in particular. The way to filter out energies (like Kaiwe) is huge to consitently draw into gas. The fact that Xerneas BREAK even is a very solid Pokemon is all the better.

With 4 Gardevoir GX (and Ralts) I wouldnt worry about a 2nd seat. All I see is having a good plan to open up with and excellerate with. To me Xerneas BREAK is a good secondary attacker not unlike Gardevoir but simply not giving two prices (Volcanion serves the same purpose in a Kaiwe deck, I even have a fun brew where Passimian serves this purpose in my Machamp GX deck).

Alolan Vulpix is a great choice but also one that isnt enforcing your opponent to attack with high damage, thus energies, thus not an ideal candidate for Gardevoir GX to handle. An opponent cannot leave a Xerneas excelling for two turns.

Cheers,

 

[JDA]

Lastly if you do want to card hunt Id say Sylveon GX is perfect to run as a 2-2. Start out with a great set up or disrupt with GX attack.

 

[Duo]

Thanks for bringing Sylveon to spotlight as well. I knew about Sylveon GX before but never actually considered it for some reason.

Right now, I can't visualize a deck list where 4-2 Xerneas/BREAK can really fit in without disrupting consistency. Other than Ultra Ball, I don't really see a way for the BREAK to be searched out, albeit it's mostly Geomancy that we'd be after here so I guess that isn't quite as important. My fundamental issue right now with Xerneas is that it brings energy consistency but it doesn't bring evolution consistency. I will still sit on it for now, but for the time being I'm actually digging the concept of 2/2 Eevee/Sylveon GX. Magical Ribbon means you can literally search out a Ralts, Rare Candy, and Gardevoir GX and there you have it. Sylveon does come at the cost of 2 prizes, but 200 HP can survive Choice Banded Alolan Ninetales GX and Drampa GX, just as some examples, whereas un-choice banded of either could OHKO Xerneas and/or BREAK. All I'm really getting at is that Sylveon could live to see another turn for either another Ribbon or GX attack.

All that being said, I'm currently looking at this deck list:

Pokemon x19

Gardevoir GX x3
Gallade x1
Kirlia x2
Ralts x4
Octillery x1
Remoraid x1
Tapu Lele GX x3
Eevee x2
Sylveon GX x2

Supporter x12

Sycamore x4
N x3
Brigette x1
Guzma x3
Acerola x1

Item x15

Rare Candy x4
Ultra Ball x4
Choice Band x3
Field Blower x2
Rescue Stretcher x2

Stadium x2

Fairy Garden x2

Energy x12

DCE x4
Fairy Energy x8

With Sylveon GX, a really good early Brigette would probably be Ralts/Remoraid/Eevee or Ralts/Ralts/Eevee if searching through your deck you notice you prized either part of your 1/1 line, and that Eevee puts you 1 Fairy Energy away from searching Rare Candy, Gardevoir GX, and/or Octillery to put you on the board next turn, and later search for your energies.

I normally run a Mallow with Octillery, but as a 1/1 line that doesn't seem to be quite worth it. If relying on the search power of Sylveon GX, then you aren't relying as much on the Mallow/Octillery combo to "search" 2.

1 Acerola I think is fundamental in Gardevoir GX. You can scoop up a dying Sylveon GX for refreshed searching power, or better yet scoop up a dying Gardevoir GX and Secret Spring her energy back onto another one. Gardevoir GX's will usually be carrying a lot of energy, so you don't want to drop it all into discard with a KO.

I'm going for 3 Tapu Lele GX instead of 2 in any deck I play for a while to experiment with the increased consistency of grabbing a supporter when you need it. Also, with the flexibility that Acerola brings, you can scoop a Gardy/Sylveon and then drop a Lele next turn. It all depends on the particular circumstance.

3 Choice Band because I really love the explosive potential of Secret Spring, DCE, Choice Band for +120 damage in one turn.

Everything else I feel is fairly standard. About the only change I would consider is -1 Stretcher or -1 Choice Band for +1 Fairy Garden to this particular build.

Thank you again everyone for your input and I would love to keep hearing it. Deck building is probably my favorite part of TCGs.

 

[Adi]

I like your decklist, but there are a couple of changes I would make.

-1 Remoraid
-1 Octillery
-1 Professor Sycamore
-1 Rescue Stretcher
-1 Tapu Lele GX
-1 Guzma

+1 Eevee
+1 N
+2 Professor's Letter
+1 Fairy Garden
+1 Fairy Energy

I dropped the Remoraid/Octillery line because in my opinion running a 1 each of is insufficient, but running 2 of is unreasonable with Sylveon GX. I dropped a Professor Sycamore, and added a N because you running too many set pieces to keep on discarding them. You would rather shuffle them in, that is also the reason I dropped a Rescue Stretcher, you won't have as many pokemon in the discard. I dropped a Tapu Lele GX cause it takes up to much bench space, and you will at most use two in a game. You have 4 Ultra Balls, and I added a Eevee, so you will have to use less Tapu Lele GX's. I don't think this decks needs to run 3 Guzma, even though with Fairy Garden you can free retreat most of the time. Dropping Guzma is something you'll have to play with, and see if you need 3. I added 2 Professor's Letters because in this list you would only run 9 Fairy Energies. Most turns until the end you want to be putting two Fairy Energies or one Fairy Energy and a DCE on bench and active pokemon, so it will help with the consistency of that. I would add a Fairy Garden because it makes using Guzma easier, and you can switch your active when it takes damage, and wait until you draw into Acerola or get a Tapu Lele GX. I hope this hepled.

 

[Nyora]

As some others have said, Sylveon-GX is actually probably the best option in a gardevoir deck. It has really the best attack to help setup, with Eevee you can get it T1, and plenty of other things too. For instance, it can attack for good damage which many others of these partners can't, it has on OK GX (though I'd still rather use Twilight) attack that could be useful, and its HP is pretty high allowing it to live some hits. Hope I helped!

 

[Duo]

Thanks for the input. I don't mean to be stubborn but I'm pretty adamant about the 3 Tapu Lele GX. That's about the only thing I'm unwilling to move on right now until I get some practice games in. I don't plan on playing 3 every game, but I want it there for the extra odds of drawing into it. Yes, I can ultra ball for it but that means I have to discard 2 cards. Yes, I can search it with Sylveon GX but that means I have to risk a turn of getting N'd. I don't think there's an issue in running a useful card in slight surplus, because extra copies can be discarded just like extra copies of any other cards any deck runs.

Of the recommendations, I think I'll go for -1 Remoraid -1 Octillery and add +2 Professor's Letter. Professor's Letter allows me to search for energy and use it on the same turn, whereas Sylveon GX searching for energy risks the energy getting N'd away anyway. I do see the redundancy and inconsistency of 1/1 Remoraid/Octillery when Sylveon is around, and speaking of Sylveon, Professor's Letter does give you more guarantees at getting Eevee evolved while still having energy in hand to charge up Gardy GX.

I'm a little bit hesitant about upping Fairy Garden. Part of the reason why I'm so intent on 3x Lele and 3x Guzma is because Guzma has more impact on my opponent as well as helping myself whereas Fairy Garden only helps myself (and maybe my opponent in a mirror match). Sylveon can search Fairy Garden, so I'm not extremely concerned about raising its count anymore.

I actually popped out a Sycamore for a Lillie this morning. I know that sounds like a bad idea, but I was thinking about running a Lillie as a replacement Octillery anyway, and now that I'm completely removing Octillery altogether, I think she's worth some experimentation and goes hand in hand with running 3x Lele to make one of supporters more viable. The extra stretcher also goes hand in hand with freely discarding Pokemon, such as Lele, via a Sycamore knowing I can get them back a little more easily.

I think there are some points that we will simply have to agree to disagree upon because we approach deck building different, but I'm totally okay with that. Perhaps a few months from now I'll think back to this post and be like "you know, that Adi guy was right, F me." Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

 

[theblackqueen]

I would say another options I did not see or might have missed to help with both evolution and energy acceleration are

BUS Ribombee, it does take up a bit of space, but its ability insures you getting the extra energy attachment that Gardevoir allows for that turn before attacking, Sylv is cool for the high Hp stall, but heavy subjected to N, where Ribombee will make those attachments consistent as it allows you to search for 2 basic energy per ability. So you could start getting your Gardevoir stacked pretty quick.

Brock's Grit, id say run 1 Rescue Stretcher and one Brock's Grit could be pretty nice, as youre going to have a bit of energy per Gardevoir and that's a lot of energy to loose if one gets KO, Brock gets those back in your deck, and you could again go into using Ribombee to get that next one hitting heavy quick.

Last is Evosoda, the combo with that and Diance would be pretty sweet and doesn't use support like Walley does.

If not nbd, I totally get being set on decklist, but those are just some options I think could assist your strategy with the deck.

^^

 

[JDA]

Thanks for bringing Sylveon to spotlight as well. I knew about Sylveon GX before but never actually considered it for some reason.

My fundamental issue right now with Xerneas is that it brings energy consistency but it doesn't bring evolution consistency. I will still sit on it for now, but for the time being I'm actually digging the concept of 2/2 Eevee/Sylveon GX. Magical Ribbon means you can literally search out a Ralts, Rare Candy, and Gardevoir GX and there you have it.

All that being said, I'm currently looking at this deck list:

[deck]

With Sylveon GX, a really good early Brigette would probably be Ralts/Remoraid/Eevee or Ralts/Ralts/Eevee if searching through your deck you notice you prized either part of your 1/1 line, and that Eevee puts you 1 Fairy Energy away from searching Rare Candy, Gardevoir GX, and/or Octillery to put you on the board next turn, and later search for your energies.
I normally run a Mallow with Octillery, but as a 1/1 line that doesn't seem to be quite worth it. If relying on the search power of Sylveon GX, then you aren't relying as much on the Mallow/Octillery combo to "search" 2.
1 Acerola I think is fundamental in Gardevoir GX. You can scoop up a dying Sylveon GX for refreshed searching power, or better yet scoop up a dying Gardevoir GX and Secret Spring her energy back onto another one. Gardevoir GX's will usually be carrying a lot of energy, so you don't want to drop it all into discard with a KO.
I'm going for 3 Tapu Lele GX instead of 2 in any deck I play for a while to experiment with the increased consistency of grabbing a supporter when you need it. Also, with the flexibility that Acerola brings, you can scoop a Gardy/Sylveon and then drop a Lele next turn. It all depends on the particular circumstance.
3 Choice Band because I really love the explosive potential of Secret Spring, DCE, Choice Band for +120 damage in one turn.

Everything else I feel is fairly standard. About the only change I would consider is -1 Stretcher or -1 Choice Band for +1 Fairy Garden to this particular build.
Thank you again everyone for your input and I would love to keep hearing it. Deck building is probably my favorite part of TCGs.

No worries, good discussions are always the way to go! I feel there are pro's and cons to both Pokemon and Im happy to see you pick a more conistent drawing engine instead of speed up engine. In my opinion both could be also equally part of the deck as a 2-2 line, but only experiment with that if you feel like it. As perhaps has been mentioned the one reason as to why I like Sylveon GX is offocurse the way it can search out a whopping 3 cards, can attack and most importantly can be back breaking during the later stages of the game with the GX attack.
The downside is that N is still in the format and thus the 3 cards search for arn't always kept to 'secure' the quicker evolution. Nontheless I am certain you'd like Sylveon GX, then again Im also quite certain you'd like Xerneas BREAK as it has some massive synergy with Gardevoir GX

As for your deck:
- Pokemon set up is great. If your going to skip out on the Remoraid I'd actually up the Eevee count and up the Gardevoir GX count. This will improve your consistent set up.
- Supporter set up seems good aswell. I personally would try to squeeze in a 4th N. Id consider dropping 1 Choice Band for that honestly.
- Item/Stadiumset up is very solid. Rare Candy isnt what it used to be (for me) but still feels like a good choice. Id personally also experiment with Evosoda.
- Energy choice seems great.

I wouldnt bother with a 3rd Fairy Garden because in essence Guzma also switches what you want to have active. If you use this to your advantage well enough you wont need Fairy Garden too much.

Cheers,

 

[Ecko9i6]

I'm just going to throw this in one more time since it seems it was completely ignored. Wally. I've seen the mention of evosoda, but Wally can literally get you a turn 1 Gardevoir, evosoda cannot.

Have a nice day

 

[HouchinsDJ]

So I apologize if what I'm about to say has already been said. I skimmed through the replies but didn't read them all. I play Gardevoir GX myself, so I have some experiences that I can share here.

I'm going to tell you right now that Diance is, by far, the best option. Being able to guarantee an evolution at the end of your turn is better than using Alolan Vulpix's Beacon just to have them N'd away next turn. We're moving to a Standard format where people are going to be playing 4 N with 2-4 Tapu Lele in just about every deck. If you use Beacon, your opponent will do everything in their power to N you next turn.

That's not to say Alolan Vulpix is worthless. On the contrary, I see why people would want to run it over Diance. If you don't get N'd the turn after you use it, and that's a big if, it can be extremely effective. However, I would personally rather go for the guarantee over the gamble.

I saw a comment on this thread that said that Diance "stops being good" after the first couple of turns. Maybe that's true, but if it was able to quickly get 1-2 Gardevoir out, didn't it do it's job? You're obviously not going to need Diance the whole game, just like you wouldn't need Alolan Vulpix the whole game. It's job is to get some quick evolutions and then let Gardevoir take over.

I see a lot of people talking about Sylveon GX. I understand the appeal, but again, it goes back to the fact that N can ruin your Magical Ribbon next turn. You have to look at your win condition, which is Gardevoir. The strategy of this deck is to get out as many Gardevoir as you can, as fast as you can. I feel like Magical Ribbon is just not consistent. I play a lot of draw support cards (Sycamore, N, Lillie) and out of the games I've played, I've only had one game where I just couldn't get momentum, which happens to every deck from time to time.

If anyone is interested, Andrew from Derium's Competitve Pokémon channel posted a Gardevoir deck list yesterday. I found it extremely helpful.