Discussion Metal Decks XY-On

crowfeather4

crowfeather4

R.I.P. Night March
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With this whole XY-On rotation hype, what's going to happen to metal decks. I know they lose Keldeo/Float Stone, but is there anything else that goes down the drain. I know it was a big thing, but can Metal Decks still do good? Will they just have to run 4 Switch, or Escape Rope? I wanna build a metal deck, but not if it will be useless XY-On. What do you think?
 
I have actually been playing with metal decks by using proxies for the Ancient Origin cards and I think metal decks will be in the top 3 types actually. I played metal decks with two different decks (M Sceptile EX/ M Heracross EX/ Shaymin EX) and (Giratina EX/ Vileplume/ Shaymin EX) my record was.

Metal/ M Rayquaza EX vs M Sceptile EX/ M Heracross EX
4-0
Metal/ M Rayquaza EX vs Giratina EX/ Vileplume
2-1
M Aggron EX/ Bronzong vs M Secptile EX/ M Heracross
5-3
M Aggron EX/ Bronzong vs Giratina EX/ Vileplume
2-5

Overall that is a solid 11-9 against what I thought would be pretty competitive decks for the XY-On format, so I would say that metal will still be a very competitive type in the XY-On format. I hope this helps!

This is a link to the M Sceptile/ M Heracross EX/ Shaymin EX deck!
http://www.pokebeach.com/forums/threads/xy-on-m-sceptile-ex-shaymin-ex-m-heracross-ex.124799/

This is a link to the Giratina EX/ Vileplume EX/Shaymin EX deck!
http://www.pokebeach.com/forums/threads/giratina-ex-shaymin-ex-vileplume.124920/
 
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Keep note that Ancient Origins is not the only thing that needs to be looked at. Metal will need to have a decent matchup with not just possible new decks, but potential XY-on decks including P-Groudon, Fighting/Bats, Raichu, M-Man, Rays, Vespiqueen, Nightmarch etc.
 
What do you think about normal metal decks? Ones that utilize Aeigislash, Dialga, Heatran, Etc. Not things like Metal/Ray
 
crowfeather4 said:
What do you think about normal metal decks? Ones that utilize Aeigislash, Dialga, Heatran, Etc. Not things like Metal/Ray
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Personally I think they will be stronger than M-Ray. Dialga has a lot of great matchups, being able to prevent an EX from attacking and then following up with the kill. Aegislash has great walling potential against any deck that doesn't run Silent Lab. M-Ray can be difficult to play due to the amount of resources you need to consistently hit high numbers.
 
On that thought, what decks do you think can utilize metal as a support engine. We already know that there's MetalRay, but what else?
 
crowfeather4 said:
On that thought, what decks do you think can utilize metal as a support engine. We already know that there's MetalRay, but what else?
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Toad and Metal of course. I've seen some Fairy decks utilise the engine to get more energy even if you can't move them around, although Excadrill is probably a better Pokemon to use.
 
Metal decks will definitely still be strong. The Keldeo/Float combo was mainly just a convenience, the deck can get along fine with Switch. Bronzong alone will be amazing as usual, not to mention Level Ball is back in Ancient Origins to make getting out even easier. Both it and Bronzor are searchable with it.

As bbninjas mentioned, Dialga is still tough and Aegislash will be a good wall as long as Silent Lab doesn't see widespread usage.

The new Registeel in Ancient Origins looks interesting as well and something I've been wanting to test. Doing a bit less damage than Excadrill but having more HP, but with the boon of having an attack that removes any energy from Pokemon-EX can allow it to be effective against decks that are slow to set up (like Primal Groudon) or require special energy to be able to attack quickly (like Giratina-EX, Toad)
 
bbninjas said:
Personally I think they will be stronger than M-Ray. Dialga has a lot of great matchups, being able to prevent an EX from attacking and then following up with the kill. Aegislash has great walling potential against any deck that doesn't run Silent Lab. M-Ray can be difficult to play due to the amount of resources you need to consistently hit high numbers.
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Dialga is good but without an easy way to replace the energy you discard with Full Metal Impact, it changes quite a bit. It is less suitable as a main attacker and more for using Chrono Wind. You use Full Metal Impact to finish off or in a pinch.
 
Talkingcat said:
Dialga is good but without an easy way to replace the energy you discard with Full Metal Impact, it changes quite a bit. It is less suitable as a main attacker and more for using Chrono Wind. You use Full Metal Impact to finish off or in a pinch.
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Whenever I play Dialga - without Keldeo - I find that I can replenish Full Metal Impact quite easily. Besides, I did mention that Full Metal Impact is good to finish off :p
 
Is the Escape Rope Metagross good enough to become a staple of new gen metal decks? If so, how thick of a line do you expect it to be?
 
Chewy said:
Is the Escape Rope Metagross good enough to become a staple of new gen metal decks? If so, how thick of a line do you expect it to be?
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Doubt it. To have a consistent Metagross line you need 2-1-2 + 2 candy, or 2-2-2. You can put int 3-3 or 3-4 switch and Escape Rope instead if you really want to, which is not as difficult to access, bar the item lock. Besides, I don't think Metal actually needs some type of free retreat with its Bronzong engine.
 
I feel like although Switch is well and good, you're talking hitting 2 Switch to power up an attacker (one to get into bench, other to bring back out). As such, I wonder if teching in something like Hawlucha with no intention to attack, just using the free retreat cost could be viable.
 
TheStrictNein said:
I feel like although Switch is well and good, you're talking hitting 2 Switch to power up an attacker (one to get into bench, other to bring back out). As such, I wonder if teching in something like Hawlucha with no intention to attack, just using the free retreat cost could be viable.
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I personally I would rotate between to Pokemon (say Dialga). I either retreat by discarding or switching my Dialga-EX into my benched Dialga-EX, that I just finished powering up. Then, once my Active is deplated, I pull up the original Dialga. Honestly with 2 Bronzong and 2 turns you can power up fully a Dialga-EX from nothing, which is generally how long the first Dialga will last before it needs switching.
 
bbninjas said:
I personally I would rotate between to Pokemon (say Dialga). I either retreat by discarding or switching my Dialga-EX into my benched Dialga-EX, that I just finished powering up. Then, once my Active is deplated, I pull up the original Dialga. Honestly with 2 Bronzong and 2 turns you can power up fully a Dialga-EX from nothing, which is generally how long the first Dialga will last before it needs switching.
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Well that's surely assuming you'll have turns where you'll either have to discard DCE or just not be able to attack at all with Diagla?

Not sure that's a good strategy.
 
TheStrictNein said:
Well that's surely assuming you'll have turns where you'll either have to discard DCE or just not be able to attack at all with Diagla?

Not sure that's a good strategy.
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No...?

Turn 12, Dialga-EX w/ 2 [M] and a DCE. 2 Bronzong + unpowered Dialga on bench. Full Metal Impact.
Turn 13 Metal Link to Dialga. Attached an Energy to Active Dialga-EX. Chrono Wind.
Turn 14 Metal Link to Dialga. Attach another Energy/Retreat. Full Metal Impact.

And that's just when you have just placed a fresh Dialga. Ideally you would already have a semi-powered attacker on the bench to retreat into straight away.
 
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