LGBTQA+ Advice & Discussion Group

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Celever

Wheeeee~
Member
Talk about a cowardly cop-out. You say you regret posting here but I really do doubt that. You know what I think? I think you didn't want there to be a support group for LGBT people without at least one person spreading their homophobia - because, to you, it doesn't matter if you continually pest them - it only matters to you if the concept of homophobia and discrimination EXISTS at least in some miniscule form in that topic as a means to comfort you. I think you posted here as a reminder to LGBT people that there are people out there that hate them.
Well, that was unnecessary...

Guys, this is a place for positivity and happiness. Being mean to ANYONE that posts here is just silly given the purpose of the topic, even if they were mean themselves. I'm the only person who responded to @Collapsing (huh, I read it as Collarspring before I had to tag it o_O) without snarkiness or a mean tone to my post, and that's really not a good thing. Maybe you're right, Lostlorn, but calling him out on it won't accomplish anything.
 

Lostlorn Forest

Alola is the best region
Member
Well, that was unnecessary...

Guys, this is a place for positivity and happiness. Being mean to ANYONE that posts here is just silly given the purpose of the topic, even if they were mean themselves. I'm the only person who responded to @Collapsing (huh, I read it as Collarspring before I had to tag it o_O) without snarkiness or a mean tone to my post, and that's really not a good thing. Maybe you're right, Lostlorn, but calling him out on it won't accomplish anything.
I tried to answer him with equal nastiness. It's not that necessary but neither were his comments. I also felt it was my duty to call out other straight peoples' hateful comments because I'm straight myself. Also, the whole "I hate the sin not the person" argument is a lie so they can comfort themselves in knowing they get away with de-humanizing people while not coming off as a cruel person.
 

Empoleon_master

I can stop watching Anime any time I don't want to
Member
So back to the topic here....
I just noticed old cuts on my now identifying as male transgender friend who's since been on anti-depressants, and I huged them for comfort until I fell asleep because I felt so bad that my friend had been in pain.
His mom has her head up her behind via trans-ignorance, and can't convince her that he's not "just going through a phase" or is Gender Queer.
Oh and 40% of transgender people will attempt suicide at one point in their lives, FUN!
The good news is..ummmm PUPPIES!!
cute puppy 1.jpg cute puppy 2.jpg cute puppy 3.jpg cute puppies 4.jpg
 

Shining Raikou

Your friendly neighborhood Raikou fan!
Elite Member
Advanced Member
Member
Lets please not respond to Collapsing anymore. Again, if anyone posts new hateful comments in this thread - please report them to me or another mod and we'll take care of it. I'd rather not encourage bickering here.

@Empoleon_master - It is very sad that trans people lack the support they need early on, which leads to a lot of problems. LGB have it pretty tough already, I feel Trans have it quite a lot worse still. There is still a lot of ignorance and fear out there regarding genderqueer people and it is heartbreaking to watch someone have to deal with it. :(
 

Shining Raikou

Your friendly neighborhood Raikou fan!
Elite Member
Advanced Member
Member
Something that was introduced in congress a couple days ago we should all be aware of:

http://www.salon.com/2015/07/23/the_equality_act_democrats_push_bill_banning_lgbt_discrimination/
http://www.advocate.com/commentary/2015/07/24/chad-griffin-we-must-fight-national-equality-bill

There is honestly not much hope of it passing in a republican controlled congress, but regardless I support it because you shouldn't be able to get fired from your job or face other types of discrimination just because of who you love/your gender identity.
 

TheWicky

Random and evil: first one, then the other
Member
A lot of businesses in my city are held together by a manager or someone in HR that's gay or genderqueer (I can name a handful that work in gaming alone), so growing up and seeing franchises everywhere that just kind of happen to have LGBTQA people employed in titular roles, it's a strange sort of culture shock to hear about open workplace discrimination.

I guess the problem, as I've come to understand after assisting in a campaign is that many people who, while they may identify more with one party over another are actually middle-of-the-road non-radicals, feel defeated by right-wingers before they feel angry/passionate enough to vote. I've met many Democrats who are hard to convince even to vote for liberal-minded candidates and their platforms over a GOP member that's threatened local economy by consciously poorly managing resources in the past(personal experience with local government). The whole political game is just unfairly tricky.
 
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Flying_Emolga

>Double Team
Member
Why won't you include the abcdefgsexuals?!?!
No, just kidding. I find it funny how sometimes you'll see a thread like this on a site then suddenly someone throws a fit for the thread not including every single label ever in existence, like each one has to be specifically mentioned and cant just be represented as the + in LGBTQIA+

Eventually it'll be SLGBTQIAPDCNGfBgBBQNYPD+
Straight Lesbian Gay Bi Trans Queer Intersex Asexual Pan Demi Colorful Non-Conforming Genderfluid Bi-Gender Pork New York's finest
Protip: it goes in order of acceptance.

Also, I'm not saying this in spite, though I do think it's ridiculous that we're becoming a chemical equation.
 

King Xerneas

Icy Goth
Member

After seeing this video for the millionth time (it's a fairly older video) I thought I should share it with everyone here. Out of every coming out video I've seen, this one really resonated with me as I had to deal with a lot of the issues she dealt with I had to deal with in my own coming out. Anyways, remember: we all deserve our best chance.
 

Jungletoad

Aspiring Trainer
Member
Obviously I don't have anything against gay people, but I would be satisfied if someone could answer me these questions. And the questions contains mature content, so be warned.

Why do gay people feel that the entire world needs to know about their sexuality? In a modern world, where it is perfectly legal and normal to be gay, why do you even need to "come out" anymore?

Why do the gay people that participate in pride parades think that they will gain acceptance from the people opposing them by dressing up in latex suits, waving around with dildos etc? Obviously there are lot's of participants that dress up perfectly normal, fighting for their cause, and I respect that. But I've never understood why a couple of 40-year old men feel that they'll gain acceptance from homophobic people by grinding on each other in overly-sexualized clothes, often waving around with inappropriate sex toys as well...?

I only want actual answers, and if my post is inappropriate it could be deleted as well. This is just something that I've always wondered about.

Thanks.
 

Celever

Wheeeee~
Member
Why do gay people feel that the entire world needs to know about their sexuality? In a modern world, where it is perfectly legal and normal to be gay, why do you even need to "come out" anymore?
Because in our society your are presumed straight until you come out. I have a friend online who came out online and not irl because he was scared to and hoped that everyone would just figure it out. He accidentally slipped up one day and came out to like two of his friends (inadvertently) and everything was just really weird and awkward because it wasn't him going "I'm gay" it was him talking about his "ex-boyfriends" or w/e.

That said, I don't think a big deal needs to be made of it. In the end when I came out I just texted two of my friends who I knew would be most OK with it, and asked them to tell everyone else before I got to school the next day. People who throw like big "coming out parties" or w/e is a bit OTT IMO, but really they can do whatever they want, it doesn't affect me.

Why do the gay people that participate in pride parades think that they will gain acceptance from the people opposing them by dressing up in latex suits, waving around with dildos etc? Obviously there are lot's of participants that dress up perfectly normal, fighting for their cause, and I respect that. But I've never understood why a couple of 40-year old men feel that they'll gain acceptance from homophobic people by grinding on each other in overly-sexualized clothes, often waving around with inappropriate sex toys as well...?
Gay pride isn't about gaining acceptance of homophobes, it's about feeling comfortable in your sexuality and sorta saying "f*ck you homophobes I don't care about you". This is why people dress up in latex and wave dildos around. Do I agree with the idea of waving dildos around? Not at all, and don't think for a second that I like the idea of doing it, but gays in general tend to be a little dramatic :p.

To put it into perspective when the suffragettes were fighting for women's rights, did they dress up in suits and sensible suits to look like men? No, they showed off their femininity with dresses and such. I guess gays are doing the same thing (although it's playing on the stereotypes which gays should want to be rid of, so I think it's a lapse in logic honestly).

Maybe someone else in this group knows better from attending gay pride festivals and such themselves why people do it, but this is my understanding.
 

TheWicky

Random and evil: first one, then the other
Member
Obviously I don't have anything against gay people, but I would be satisfied if someone could answer me these questions. And the questions contains mature content, so be warned.

Why do gay people feel that the entire world needs to know about their sexuality? In a modern world, where it is perfectly legal and normal to be gay, why do you even need to "come out" anymore?

Why do the gay people that participate in pride parades think that they will gain acceptance from the people opposing them by dressing up in latex suits, waving around with dildos etc? Obviously there are lot's of participants that dress up perfectly normal, fighting for their cause, and I respect that. But I've never understood why a couple of 40-year old men feel that they'll gain acceptance from homophobic people by grinding on each other in overly-sexualized clothes, often waving around with inappropriate sex toys as well...?

I only want actual answers, and if my post is inappropriate it could be deleted as well. This is just something that I've always wondered about.

Thanks.
So, I want to preface this by saying, "I'm genuinely sorry if this comes off as abrasive."

I encourage everybody to read a book on the timeline of the gay movement, mostly to understand certain niche things about the culture that's been created, as there are certain references to the culture that are deeply rooted in titular events in gay history. I'm mostly going to brush over the American gay history, I can't really speak for the rest of the world.

The discussion of homosexuality has largely been met with an unjustified fear of non-nuclear, non-heterosexual relationships because, well, it's different. No matter what the case, it's been proven that we are prone to fear things that we don't understand or don't relate to. You couldn't go anywhere in the 20th century without hearing someone speak out against homosexuality as an affront to good christian morality. Having it talked up for so long as being sinful in nature, those men and women began rebelling against a society that was taught to not want them. That's where you get stuff like gay-friendly bars and the heavy focus on scant fashion choices.

There was a kind of uneasy atmosphere for a number of reasons. Sex just wasn't a discussion, and hookup culture stemmed from having sex without trying to draw attention to oneself, and it's thanks to a lack of education on safe sex that led to the spread of numerous STDs. AIDS, the biggest one, was marketed by mass media as "the gay virus" for a long time. People were openly harassed and gay bars were raided because it was believed that they were cesspools of disease. Eventually, government allowed for police raids and strict policies to dictate what you need to do to be seen as "normal". The most infamous case of this was the Stonewall riots, where an attack on a bar in New York led to enforcing people to follow a number of oppressive rules. You had to wear at least three articles of clothing assigned to your gender, there were rules about public displays of affection, you couldn't walk down the wrong side of the street, it was nightmarish.

The real reason for big, flashy pride parades is because it was a drag queen, Marsha P. Johnson, who went the Stonewall Riots and convinced enough people to start a revolution. Every year since 1969, drag has been a big part of pride parades everywhere. And, as many people are aware, "drag" is a spectrum of performance art, ranging from high-fashion, glamorous, feminine make-up artists to comedic, campy performers with a focus on shock-value humor and everything in between. Gay pride has also evolved to incorporate new sexual orientations, new genders, and the like, which is why "the gay movement" has changed to "the LGBTQA movement". The approach with pride is flashy and radical, but harmless so as to be inclusive to those who want to take part.

Now, we are getting to a point where people are discovering the fluidity of sexuality, but for a lot of places around the world, ganderqueer people are still shunned and mistreated for being who they are. The real mission is to get people to be ok with gay(and everything else). So while you may live a life where it isn't a big deal, the rest of the world isn't as "perfectly modern" as you claim.

But really, you have to understand that every potential minority has also had to combat the white man for acceptance. Gay pride and all the trimmings stems from the same issue that african-americans have had, asian americans, even what women have had to go through; Finding their own way to show their strength as a group of people to attain equality. It's really the most conservative thing I can think of.
 

professorlight

Ice Queen
Member
I find very curious that jungletoad posted that, as I was thinking along the same lines early on today (as I did since a long time ago); I wouldn't have worded some parts as he did, but the question was quite similar.

The issues that I notice here (I won't speak for jungletoad) is that:

Gay pride isn't about gaining acceptance of homophobes, it's about feeling comfortable in your sexuality and sorta saying "f*ck you homophobes I don't care about you".

Sorry, dear, but those things are not the same; I could go on with an essay about the concept of "pride" as a flawed interpretation of the self (which is in fact what I was developing this morning), but to make it short, acceptance of being gay (or any other condition pertaining sexuality or identity) does not (should not) imply any kind of "f**k you" to anyone. In fact, that is quite the opposite of what it means; what people usually mean by "pride", refers purely to the acceptance and internalization of natural, irremediable impulses against a previous misconception; you have two choices, accept your condition or live "in the closet"... those are both heavily personal choices, and therefore there isn't a wrong choice there; both are understandable, and carry their own consequences.
There is really not much to be proud in accepting being gay; there is, however, much happiness to be found on it, and that is, I feel, what is at the core of what people call "pride"; however, the vehicles they use to express this "pride" are, at least to me, doing more harm than good.
If you want to get the actual meaning for pride, you would have to look at it as the result of a potentially harmful conscious, not-forced moral stance, in this view, for example, a straight person who realizes the humanity in defending gay rights would be doing something worth being proud of. A gay person doing the same, however, would be happy, and proud only by the moral decision of supporting them, which should be assumed of them (otherwise, it would be a somewhat hypocritical position, being gay but not supporting gay rights. Or they might be just masochistic, that's also a chance).

Going to your suffragette example, the suffragettes didn't hide their femininity, but they didn't exaggerate it either; as you said, it's a lapse in logic, and a PR failure; by feeding the collective idea of gay people as leather-wearing-shrill-flaming people calling for attention, all they do is to let the louder, less "adjusted" (on the specific context of public opinion; I'm sure they're perfectly pleasant when they have a shirt on top of the bondage gear) majority be the face of their legitimate cause, and feed the animosity of those who oppose them; a better option would be, for example, a field day, where straight people can interact with gay people and find out that who they like doesn't matter; all that matters is that they're all equal.

Also, they're just so tacky. Seriously, the one stereotype the parades don't hold is gay men's legendary fashion sense; such a tragedy.

The real reason for big, flashy pride parades is because it was a drag queen, Marsha P. Johnson, who went the Stonewall Riots and convinced enough people to start a revolution. Every year since 1969, drag has been a big part of pride parades everywhere. And, as many people are aware, "drag" is a spectrum of performance art, ranging from high-fashion, glamorous, feminine make-up artists to comedic, campy performers with a focus on shock-value humor and everything in between. Gay pride has also evolved to incorporate new sexual orientations, new genders, and the like, which is why "the gay movement" has changed to "the LGBTQA movement". The approach with pride is flashy and radical, but harmless so as to be inclusive to those who want to take part.

Now, we are getting to a point where people are discovering the fluidity of sexuality, but for a lot of places around the world, ganderqueer people are still shunned and mistreated for being who they are. The real mission is to get people to be ok with gay(and everything else). So while you may live a life where it isn't a big deal, the rest of the world isn't as "perfectly modern" as you claim.

But really, you have to understand that every potential minority has also had to combat the white man for acceptance. Gay pride and all the trimmings stems from the same issue that african-americans have had, asian americans, even what women have had to go through; Finding their own way to show their strength as a group of people to attain equality. It's really the most conservative thing I can think of.

As a historicist approach, that may very well be true; the stonewall riots really were a tipping point on the presence of gay people on the US.

However, you said it yourself; what was initially a gay community with close ties to drag culture became a collective dealing with all kinds of people, all kinds of orientations, battling on different fronts, and, as time passed, facing different obstacles (less and less, thankfully); however, the confrontative model born out of the past oppression and in the riots (riots; I can't stress that word enough), seems quite outdated at this point; society has changed a lot since then, and so has the movement, but it seems their methods haven't adapted.

Besides, this historicist approach doesn't answer the question, it only explains why, but not how; if many people, in the US and everywhere else (and if I understand it correctly, in most of the western world there isn't so much overt hate of gay people as in parts of the US) would be driven off by the forceful approach, how exactly does the parade help them to be accepted (in a mainstream society, which is their goal), when it only internalizes, remarks, and showcases differences that should not exist in the first place? does it do anything beyond a very misguided catharsis? and if it does, is that catharsis worth the impact of perpetuating harmful and unreal stereotypes (at least, I haven't noticed many hairy large men on bondage gear and whips buying groceries lately) and boogeymen held by the people opposing them out of inculture and prejudice?

In that case, it wouldn't be "harmless" to those who don't take part on them, since the people participating also speak for them; flashiness and radicality are no replacements for education, awareness and humanity, and as they're the living proof of, traditions can, and should, change with the times.
 
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TheWicky

Random and evil: first one, then the other
Member
Problem #1: You patronized @Celever and I don't like that kind of thing.

Problem#2:
Besides, this historicist approach doesn't answer the question, it only explains why, but not how;
@Jungletoad didn't use the word "how" once in his post, he only asked "why". So yeah, I think I did answer the question. So, keeping the 5Ws and 1H in mind, you have some good concerns I want to discuss:

In that case, it wouldn't be "harmless" to those who don't take part on them, since the people participating also speak for them; flashiness and radicality are no replacements for education, awareness and humanity, and as they're the living proof of, traditions can, and should, change with the times.

You said it yourself, Gay Pride isn't just about acceptance from everyone who isn't gay, it's also about self-acceptance. All of the time spent chanting "we're here, we're queer, get used to it!" allows for people to come to terms with their own orientation. The point is that it's different from the norm, like how roughly 10% of the world population being gay makes that 10% different from the norm.

I'm not going to argue that Pride parades should be a part of gay culture for infinity, but at least for now we still live in a society that requires education about sexuality and the role it can play as a portion of ones identity. In part, Pride is utilized as a chance to talk about safe sex, relationships, networking, and just being normal on ones own terms. It is increasingly becoming a platform for STD testing and information on what you can do to protect yourself and your partner(s), among other comprehensive topics.

Besides, this historicist approach doesn't answer the question, it only explains why, but not how; if many people, in the US and everywhere else (and if I understand it correctly, in most of the western world there isn't so much overt hate of gay people as in parts of the US) would be driven off by the forceful approach, how exactly does the parade help them to be accepted (in a mainstream society, which is their goal), when it only internalizes, remarks, and showcases differences that should not exist in the first place? does it do anything beyond a very misguided catharsis? and if it does, is that catharsis worth the impact of perpetuating harmful and unreal stereotypes (at least, I haven't noticed many hairy large men on bondage gear and whips buying groceries lately) and boogeymen held by the people opposing them out of inculture and prejudice?

I'm afraid I've never seen statistics or testimonials of people that feel like they can't join a Pride parade, so I can't really make heads or tails of that comment. From my own experience, it's just about as exciting as Mardi Gras to people in the US that aren't even slightly hispanic, or Halloween, which isn't really practiced for it's original religious intent, yet people are used to dressing up and partying. Gay Pride, like Independence Day or Thanksgiving, is a means of coming together and remembering the accomplishments of those people who gave us the ability to be here so we can move forward. If you feel excluded from that, I mean...You can call the organizers, write a letter to your congressman, talk to the PTA...

When you say "differences that shouldn't exist in the first place", what do you mean by that?
 
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professorlight

Ice Queen
Member
Problem #1: You patronized @Celever and I don't like that kind of thing.

Problem#2:

@Jungletoad didn't use the word "how" once in his post, he only asked "why". So yeah, I think I did answer the question. So, keeping the 5Ws and 1H in mind, you have some good concerns I want to discuss:



You said it yourself, Gay Pride isn't just about acceptance from everyone who isn't gay, it's also about self-acceptance. All of the time spent chanting "we're here, we're queer, get used to it!" allows for people to come to terms with their own orientation. The point is that it's different from the norm, like how roughly 10% of the world population being gay makes that 10% different from the norm.

I'm not going to argue that Pride parades should be a part of gay culture for infinity, but at least for now we still live in a society that requires education about sexuality and the role it can play as a portion of ones identity. In part, Pride is utilized as a chance to talk about safe sex, relationships, networking, and just being normal on ones own terms. It is increasingly becoming a platform for STD testing and information on what you can do to protect yourself and your partner(s), among other comprehensive topics.



I'm afraid I've never seen statistics or testimonials of people that feel like they can't join a Pride parade, so I can't really make heads or tails of that comment. From my own experience, it's just about as exciting as Mardi Gras to people in the US that aren't even slightly hispanic, or Halloween, which isn't really practiced for it's original religious intent, yet people are used to dressing up and partying. Gay Pride, like Independence Day or Thanksgiving, is a means of coming together and remembering the accomplishments of those people who gave us the ability to be here so we can move forward. If you feel excluded from that, I mean...You can call the organizers, write a letter to your congressman, talk to the PTA...

When you say "differences that shouldn't exist in the first place", what do you mean by that?

Let's let celever speak for himself, shall we? if he felt I patronized him, I can only apologize, and say it wasn't my intention; as I said, I was thinking about that this morning, and it was still fresh on my mind; I probably said more than I needed to explain anyway.

Jungletoad didn't use the word, but look at his "why"'s in context, they were about the parade as a tool to convince people to support their cause, which was also my point.
But, anyway, I wasn't talking about his question (I said I wouldn't speak for him, after all), but about my question, the one I posed in the previous paragraphs; a historicist approach answers "why are gay parades this way" (it started with the gay community and drag queens, on a heavily repressive environment), but after so many years, it's not about visibility anymore, which was its purpose back then, so, "how do those parts, born out of a historical context with a specific objective, help the cause on this new context?" becomes the question.

So, how does chanting and strutting in leather with dildos help with self-acceptance? that is a purely internal process, and only you can do it; regardless, it still perpetuates a division; "I'm here, I'm queer, get used to it" is directed to the people who hate them; it's a reminder of their difference and its permanence (and not a very polite one at that, but okay, I'll give them a pass on that; as I said, it's outdated, and its roots lay in riots, that's hardly a good soil to grow politeness).
But, how many people who hate gay people need that reminder? isn't the parade itself a reminder? or their very existence, and the fact that they're becoming increasingly more present on society? they hate that more than chanting, and that happens Every. Single. Day. unlike the chant.
So, the chanting is useless from an awareness perspective (and so is the 10% statistic); all that matters is that gay people exist, whatever their numbers, and that they are people, just like straight people are people, but they just have a tiny tiny difference on their preferences.

As an example, I don't go around chanting "I'm here, I don't like hot dogs, get used to it!", because I know it's moot; no one cares, even though 10% of people don't like hot dogs (a completely made up statistic, but you probably get my point); all that should matter is that the people in the parade are the exact same as the people outside of it, and their difference is as important and deserving of discrimination (on either way) as liking or disliking hot dogs (which it is, since both are stupid things to establish divisions about).

My point (again, I'm not speaking for jungletoad) is that it is very good that the parade does more than colorful people prancing about; however, it's still just the colorful people who prance about, and they are still the face of the event, as is the chant; those are divisions, and they are perpetuating them with such a forceful (and outdated) approach; my suggestion of a field day wasn't out of the blue; I had this very conversation with a friend of mine a long time ago and I thought it back then; doing that allows everything you said, but with the added (and much needed) benefit of bringing down the barriers between gay and straight people (which are the ones I was talking about), literally sitting them on the same table to share and learn about each other on a completely normal environment (after all, I'm positive the people in the parade don't wear their... ensembles, to work and PTA meetings; they're just like everyone else without them); they are who, in their position as "mainstream straight society", need to realize that the differences of race, gender and sexuality are less defined and relevant than they seem right now, that we're all human, whatever our genetics, and accept the outsiders in; once the outsiders are truly in, then there won't be any barriers; labels as gay or straight would become meaningless, because, they are.

The thing is, haters don't deserve hate, they deserve pity, and in most cases they won't change (so, why bother to scream at them?); society, however, does change, and leaves them behind (which is what they really hate), which is why at this point, policies aimed at a forceful introduction of a "brand new" class of people (as they were back in the 50's) on society's eye are counter-producing, since society is now aware of its existence; they fulfilled their purpose; now it is time to stop excusing the behaviors of the past (just as now gay-shaming has become nearly inexcusable) and move on to the future, change the approach to incorporate those who are outside not because of hate, but out of ignorance or misinformation, because those can be fixed, and they will be fixed, eventually.

I hope it's clear what I mean here; the concept of the parade isn't so bothersome as the ideology of difference behind it, an ideology I've found, in my studies, that outsider groups are often as keen to keep as the insiders are, until time "erases" those differences.
But the truth is that those differences are simply not there, but all people have to realize that first. It's not a much different process as coming out, really; both are about realizing a personal truth and changing one's worldview.

So, in a way, you could say society needs to "come out", and gay parades are part of society.
 
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TheWicky

Random and evil: first one, then the other
Member
@professorlight I agree with a lot of your opinions, but I don't think Pride parades are ready to be phased out or edited into a form that's easier to swallow just yet. Gay Pride has built a very deep meaning for itself, woven from many many messages about the acceptance of LGBTQA individuals, consisting of personal discoveries, hopes for a bigot-less future, outcries for help, declarations of uniqueness, the list goes on. Among many other things, Pride is there to say "it's okay to be this kind of radical, you're not hurting anybody by being your gayest self", which I would argue is the true message behind "we're here, we're queer". Gay Pride is like a yokai; It's off-putting, but it's not intended to hurt anybody.

Unfortunately, there are still people that don't seem to understand that "it's ok to be gay", and I believe the biggest threat is youth who have inherited that hater mode of thinking. Just recently, Leslie Jordan threw hot coffee at some college-age boys who barged into a Starbucks in LA and started chanting homophobic slurs.

I agree that the phrasing over the years hasn't been the best, so it's my belief that we need big, flashy, feathery, scantily clad boys leading parades who can send the message that being (so unbelievably) gay doesn't hurt anybody. There should be more publicity and workshops during Pride parades that push that message, that it's different but not weird. We need to talk more about fluid sexuality, and if you'd rather build a romantic bond with a man after a harsh breakup with your girlfriend, it's nobody's business but your own, and we need to keep preaching that you can love whoever you want and be as vibrant as you feel like, until the majority of society can find the futility in giving meaning to sexual orientation labels. So no, the purpose of the parades has not been fulfilled. Besides, I think they're a lot of fun to look at.
 

professorlight

Ice Queen
Member
The problem with uniqueness, as I see it, is that most outsider groups tend to focus on that uniqueness as a scaffolding to support their collective identity (necessary on the beginning of their struggle); but all scaffoldings have to come down eventually, and I imagine that is where we think different; I believe society (at least in most of the western world) is now mature enough about gay issues that the more confrontational and self-reinforcing methods of social change can be replaced; maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm right, it's just my opinion.
It is quite true that there are lots of ignorant people out there, and they will always be there, sadly; but what matters, since that's inevitable, is that they're never the majority, which they're less and less; I'd wager that thirty years ago, no one would have dared to throw coffee at those kids, and if they did, it wouldn't have ended well for that person. So, that has changed for the better, and it will continue to change; however, I'm not sure that throwing coffee has done much in the way of explaining to those morons in what they are wrong, and that is what I worry about in this.

Oh, but I didn't mean the purpose of the parade itself, that's fine; I meant the chants and the spectacle, whose purpose was to shock the population to a point where they can't just sweep them under the rug anymore; this is a time where gay people can now marry, and many still hold onto that dumb "but won't the kids grow up gay?!" argument; that is the kind of thing that I think needs to be addressed now, and I'm, not sure, that a gaggle of guys in leather tutus help much on that front.
Beyond that small clarification, we agree on everything (except the "fun to look at" part, but, that's unimportant), so I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree about the methods, but we do agree about the meaning behind it; the event itself is a good thing for now, I can understand it is needed; hopefully in the future, "gay parade" will become like a "straight parade" is now (non-existent).
 

Shining Raikou

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Obviously I don't have anything against gay people, but I would be satisfied if someone could answer me these questions. And the questions contains mature content, so be warned.

Why do gay people feel that the entire world needs to know about their sexuality? In a modern world, where it is perfectly legal and normal to be gay, why do you even need to "come out" anymore?

Remember, it's not only sexuality, but about love too. In an everyday person sense, it is important to come out to live a happy and fulfilling life without question or fear. To love and date who you want, marry who you want, and not live up to social expectation of your parents, or whomever else. I feel you are hinting a bit at the many celebrities we hear about in the news as having come out, and that's important too. This inspires other people to come out and be themselves.

On the subject of the modern world... we have come quite a long way in terms of rights but there is still a ways to go. There are a lot of unfair practices and ignorant people still out there. If you can still get fired from work, denied services, discriminated against in general, basically anything that we can't enjoy that a common white male would be able to without question. I feel it is a better time now for LGBTQA rights than it ever has been though.

Why do the gay people that participate in pride parades think that they will gain acceptance from the people opposing them by dressing up in latex suits, waving around with dildos etc? Obviously there are lot's of participants that dress up perfectly normal, fighting for their cause, and I respect that. But I've never understood why a couple of 40-year old men feel that they'll gain acceptance from homophobic people by grinding on each other in overly-sexualized clothes, often waving around with inappropriate sex toys as well...?

I've been to one pride parade and I don't think I'll go again in the foreseeable future. While I am gay and support rights for LGBTQA+, I feel a lot of that message has been lost in translation to some of the pride happenings. It's a result of the influence of media, clubs, sponsors, etc. What I notice is a lot of off putting and inappropriate energy at some of the events. People will get on apps and hook up with each other, companies who specialize in adult products are sponsoring and present, there seems to be some very questionable dress attire (if any). I'm not talking about dressing to not conform to gender stereotypes, but rather just wearing stuff to "show off". For someone like me, this is a big turn off to going to these sort of things because it's an excuse to get lewd in a public space. Not everyone gets involved in this stuff in the LGBTQA community, but it's pretty hard to miss. I see the point in parades/etc, but I feel like we need to clean them up a bit in order for them to have more meaning. In contrast though, I've seen some pretty tacky straight events too.

My stance on pride is, support the places in your community doing good for LGBTQA+ people, be informed about the issues, know politicians who support/oppose our rights - VOTE (when you can), and give back when you can to worthy causes (such as helping LGBTQA+ with public services or support). I regularly make donations to the local LGBT community center. You don't need to act a fool/dance around in underwear to show your support.
 
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TheWicky

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It's interesting to me when someone says "homosexuality is a natural occurrence". I read a study recently about the possible existence of a male attraction gene and female attraction gene, and that hypothetically, girls who have a male-attraction gene (and as a result, are boy-crazy) are more likely to pass their boy-craziness on to their offspring, regardless of gender.
 

Shining Raikou

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@LeifTheExplorer, (and everyone else) please keep in mind this is not a debate topic. This thread should be about news concerning LGBTQA+, questions, support, and positivity. To you and anyone else, if you wish to shed light on something concerning religion (or anything) vs. homosexuality in a debate style format, please start a new topic. If you are not brave enough to do that, then maybe your comments aren't worth posting. ;)

Additionally, any posters who are posting repeatedly please let know if you would like membership in this group or not. I would prefer not to start moderating posts because people are not following the instructions in the OP. I'm really going to start filtering posts after this, since people have not fully abided by the group rules.

Thanks!
 
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