Discussion Let's talk about Umbreon-EX's First attack

TheUltimateAbsol

Truth or Ideals? It's all Black and White to me
Member
Yeah, you might think I'm crazy. I'm some Deliqnuent trying to rid you of your home and cards. It doesn't matter.
Umbreon EX
[C] Night Veil: 20 Damage. Discard any number of cards from your hand. Then draw an equal amount of cards from your deck.

20 Damage. The power of hitting a wild Tauros in the safari zone with a rock but not hard enough for it to run away. It's pathetic. But it's Dark Type. Something we've needed to counter Night march is a dark type that can fit into a variety of decks, deal just enough damage to KO a night marcher, and maybe survive another turn. Yveltal XY doesn't fulfill this because of it's Dark Energy cost, and Zoroark also doesn't fulfill this because it takes a DCE and a turn of setup.

So let's factor in Dark Typing weakness. This makes it so you get double damage on troublesome decks like Night March and Trevenant. That's 40 damage standard, not even enough to KO a Pumpkaboo. But now add in a Fighting Fury Belt. Bam! You now can hit magical numbers: 60 on every pumpkaboo, 30 on every joltik, 60 on every phantump, etc...

Although 60 on something like Trevenant isn't exactly very uplifting, the second effect of the card makes up for it. Discarding some of your hand to draw new cards can help get around the pain of item lock, and even throw away those item cards you don't need.

...I know it's not that much to talk about, but I'm sick of Umbreon only being judged on it's EXTREMELY situational second attack.

The [C] typing of energy can also help it flow right into something like a fairy deck, in which multiple attackers and weakness are like the bread and butter of the deck.
 
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TheLunaticHypno

Just your average Hypno fan
Member
Ok, I'm REALLY not sure why no one has talked about this, but why don't people play this in night march and vespiqueen? You can discard cards (pokemon) and draw cards to help get them in the discard even more. Ie battle comp, ultra ball, etc.
 

MarshalBry

Aspiring Trainer
Member
Ok, I'm REALLY not sure why no one has talked about this, but why don't people play this in night march and vespiqueen? You can discard cards (pokemon) and draw cards to help get them in the discard even more. Ie battle comp, ultra ball, etc.

The issue with that is that you have to use its attack and then get it out of the active slot next turn, whereas with what they currently use they can generally discard enough cards to keep going in the same turn and hit with Night March/Bee Revenge. It could perhaps still work in a slower variant that's more built around hitting the higher numbers reliably though?
 

Javi Blizz

Spanish TCG Player
Member
Ok, I'm REALLY not sure why no one has talked about this, but why don't people play this in night march and vespiqueen? You can discard cards (pokemon) and draw cards to help get them in the discard even more. Ie battle comp, ultra ball, etc.

Maybe it's because Umbreon EX is suppossed to make the prize trade worse, since it's an EX in a non EX deck.

I don't like the idea of using it a a NM counter, because you're relying on FFB. That can be a problem. You need Startling Megaphone too, to get rid of Joltik's/Pumpkaboo's FFB. So, unless you have played Students this turn, the thing become more and more complex. And if you played it, you'd probably lost another Umbreon EX for the prize trade.

Let's talk about numbers: Umbreon EX has 170 base HP. That means 4 Lampent and 4 Pumpkaboo (since Umbreon EX has [P] resistence) in your opponent's discard pile at least, which it's quite possible (2 BC + 1 Ultra Ball) + Muscle Band/FFB in order to be KOed by Joltik. Your opponent can play almost every turn Students to get a DCE + Muscle Band/FFB. And after KOing the first Joltik, they only need the DCE. If you KO 1 Joltik per turn and they KO 1 Umbreon EX, in the best scenario possible, they'd only have 1 Pokémon left in the field and you'd have lost due to prize trade. Now, let's supposse that you KO a Joltik using FFB instead of Muscle Band. You resist the attack. Your opponent plays Startling Megaphone and BANG! 4 prizes in a turn (Remember that after 1 Joltik is KOed they don't need the Muscle Band/FFB to KO you, so they can simply search DCE+ Startling Megaphone with Students).

So, in conclusion, this card can't be considered a counter to NM, but maybe it could work as a check.
 
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