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Keldeo-EX/Blastoise - Discussion Thread

Nigel

Extra Spicy
Member
Keldeo-EX/Blastoise - Rushing in to Soak the Format!

By [smod]Nigel[/smod] and [member]Blah[/member]​

keldeo-exscan.jpg

Blastoise/Keldeo is a new deck being hyped with the release of Boundaries Crossed- and for a good reason. Blastoise's Ability, Deluge, allows you to attach as many water energies as you want to your Pokemon as often as you like during your turn. Both Keldeo-EX's attack and Blastoise's own attack benefit from this, allowing Blastoise to do a minimum of 100 damage whenever it attacks and allowing Keldeo to do a minimum of 110 damage (unless they have DCEs attached instead of water energies). That's enough to 2HKO anything; In Keldeo's case, even anything with an Eviolite attached.

Further more, Keldeo-EX's Ability, Rush In, allows this deck to resist Catcher stalling, meaning that Blastoise's heavy four retreat cost would not affect the deck's performance, which was one of the major setbacks of Reshiboar, a similar deck that was previously meta.

With the release of Boundaries Crossed, Skyla and Computer Search have increased the playability of clunky Stage 2 decks in this format- allowing you to Skyla or Computer Search for an Ultra Ball, Rare Candy, or (in Computer Search's case) Blastoise, allowing for a much faster set up enabling you to get a T2 set up the majority of the time.

Other cards in this format can also make use of Deluge, including Mewtwo-EX, which also counters mirror. This makes Blastoise/Keldeo an intimidating contender for this format, which Cities results are sure to show.



Sample list for Blastoise/Keldeo:

3 Squirtle
1 Wartortle
3 Blastoise
3 Keldeo EX
2 Mewtwo EX

4 N
2 Bianca
4 Professor Juniper
2 Skyla
2 Random Receiver
4 Ultra Ball
2 Level Ball
4 Pokemon Catcher
2 Super Scoop Up
3 Energy Retrieval
4 Rare Candy
1 Super Rod
1 Computer Search

11 Water Energy
2 Double Colorless Energy​


This is a very straightforward list. It revolves around getting the Blastoise out fast and proceeding to dominate your opponent with high damage attacks, while fueling your attackers with Energy Retrieval and healing with Super Scoop Up. It doesn't include very many extra attackers like some lists can, so keep in mind that this deck is extremely flexible and can encompass a wide variety of strategies. Go here for a list of staples and their descriptions.

Super Scoop Up - This card is normally shunned due to the simple fact that it decelerates energy and that it requires a coin flip. However, it works great in this deck because after picking up a damaged Keldeo EX, you can place it on your bench, reattach all of the energy, and proceed to use Rush In to get Keldeo EX right back where it was, only this time, with no damage. The fact that it's a flip is annoying, but when you do get heads it significantly helps your Keldeos stay on the field for as long as possible.

Rare Candy - A staple in any Stage 2 deck. It allows for the quick set up of a Blastoise to get those attackers running as soon as possible. A single copy of Wartortle is still included for emergencies when you can't get the Rare Candy/Blastoise combo, but Rare Candy is still the primary way for this deck to set up.

Energy Retrieval - Another card that helps get those energy onto the field as fast as possible. Since this deck often runs heavy Juniper and Ultra Ball lines, lots of water energy may be going in the discard early. This is extremely powerful, because that means just one Energy Retrieval and one other energy can get a Keldeo EX going in one turn. You can even drop more than one of these in a turn to stack massive energy on a Keldeo EX and hit for huge damage!

Computer Search - Another staple in pretty much every deck. Having the ability to search for any card is always extremely helpful and can get you out of some sticky situations. There's pretty much no reason not to run this card, as Gold Potion is next to useless in this deck because you can already heal with Super Scoop Up.

Mewtwo EX - While not the main attacker of the deck, this card does extremely well due to the energy acceleration it receives from Blastoise. It helps in the mirror by KOing opposing Keldeo EX and Mewtwo EX with large sums of energy on them, and is a great extra attacker besides that. Mewtwo also helps cover up the problem with Shaymin EX, who can run through this deck if you're not prepared.

Pokemon Center - Pokemon Center is played in this deck as a counter to Darkrai-EX. With this card, Darkrai-EX can't 2HKO you, and you can still 2HKO them. The pros of this card over Eviolite is that Eviolite can easily be Tool Scrapper'd away and unless they're playing a counter stadium, Pokemon Center will remain in play for the rest of the game, even when previous Keldeos are knocked out.


Techs:


Keep in mind that this deck is often extremely tight for space and it's often not worth including extra cards, but some can be extremely useful, so here's a list of what to consider.

Switch - While this card is often useless because of Keldeo EX's ability, it can be extremely helpful in getting another attacker active besides Keldeo EX, such as Mewtwo or any other techs you might be running. This is often not a good choice, since Keldeo only has two retreat and you can get the energy back with Energy Retrieval, but it's not totally out of this world to consider including it.

Tool Scrapper - Since Garbodor totally ruins this deck's strategy, this isn't a bad idea to include if you have a lot of Garbodors in your metagame. It can also be used to scrap various tools such as Eviolite, Rescue Scarf, and EXP share, but remember that Keldeo's attack pretty much goes through an Eviolite anyway, so this card should normally stick to being a Garbodor counter.

Cilan - While taking up your supporter for the turn, Cilan can net you a massive three energy from your deck, enabling you to power up a Keldeo in a single turn. Combine this with Energy Retrieval, and you could have a Keldeo EX doing 170-190 damage within the first few turns. It's risky because it takes up the supporter, but besides that, this card has fantastic synergy with Blastoise/Keldeo.

Eviolite - A great card in any deck that uses basic attackers, this helps Keldeo EX survive even longer. The only reason it's not in the list above is because that list focuses on being more consistent and speedy rather than having tanking capacity. Keep in mind Eviolite can be Tool Scrappered, but besides that it's definitely a card to include if you can find the room.

Kyurem NV - This card can crush certain decks if timed correctly. 30 damage to everything on your opponent's field is nothing to scoff at, and if you get it out early game it can be devastating to other Stage 2 decks' setups. This card also helps against Sigilpyh, because otherwise Blastoise has to be the one to handle it which is not ideal.

Kyogre EX - Similar to Kyurem with it's ability to spread, this card can also ruin the opponent's setup, while setting up KO's for Keldeo EX. It's not great because it's just another EX attacker and Keldeo EX tends to be preferred in almost any situation, but it can definitely help against other Stage 2 decks.


Matchups:


Darkrai/Hydreigon: Even

This matchup is all about speed. Whoever gets their Stage 2 up first is at a huge advantage. If you can get a Blastoise going, get as much energy on the field as fast as you can, because Hydreigon can OHKO your Blastoise with ease. Sigilpyh can also wall you for eternity and force you to bring up Blastoise to attack. However, with 5 energy on a Keldeo EX, you can OHKO Hydreigon, making this matchup completely even. It's often a war of how long each player can keep the Stage 2 up, so if you swarm the Blastoise, this matchup should be no problem.

Darkrai/Terrakion/Landorus EX/Mewtwo: Unfavorable

If they drop/start Landorus EX, the matchup instantly becomes somewhat favorable again, but until then, this match is going to be a hard one. The Mewtwo stops you from loading energy onto a single Keldeo EX to OHKO their field, and Darkrai only requires a few trainers to set up quickly while you require a Stage 2. It's a fast, very consistent, and high damaging deck that is going to give Keldeo EX/Blastoise a lot of trouble. The main way for you to win this matchup is to flip a lot of heads on SSU, get energy on a lot of different attackers, and try to get set up faster then they do. Eviolite also helps the matchup a lot because if they don't run Tool Scrapper, they're going to be Three hit-KO'ing your Keldeo EX's.

Hammertime w/ and w/o Terrakion/Landorus EX: Favorable

This matchup should be no issue for you. The energy deceleration can get annoying early game, but once you have a Blastoise up, Energy retrieval completely negates Crushing Hammer and since they don't run Mewtwo, you can stack as much energy as you want onto a Keldeo EX and just burn through their field with it. The only way you're going to lose this is if you either don't get a Blastoise up or you whiff all your energy completely.

Terrakion EX/Landorus EX/Terrakion/Mewtwo: Slightly Favorable

With a quick Blastoise, you can obliterate this deck by OHKOing Terrakion and taking a ton of quick prizes off of everything else. However, once again, Mewtwo is extremely annoying and a good player will constantly pressure you to have your own Mewtwos throughout the match. It's still favorable because they take a while to get momentum with their Terrakions, so just watch out for the Mewtwo and you should be fine.

Empoleon/Stuff: Favorable

If you get the Blastoise up and don't whiff energy, you can't lose. Stack five energy onto a Keldeo EX and you sweep through their Stage 2's while the best they can do is Two-hit KO your basics. Try to avoid using Mewtwo as many Empoleon varients run Mew EX, so just use Keldeo EX and the game should be yours in no time. The only thing to fear is a Turn 2 Empoleon as they can take out your Squirtles fast, so make sure to be swarming the Squirtles early game.

Zekeels(or Mewtwo/Eels): Very Unfavorable

Once again, Mewtwo is showing up to troll you. Only this time, it's the one of the main attackers. Even if you drop your own Mewtwo, they're just going to pop up with another one, Dynamoter, and continue sweeping. The only way for you to win this is to somehow keep the Eels off the field early game and then hope they whiff DCE late game. Keep in mind that Eels is going to decrease in popularity a lot because of Landorus EX, but if you are unfortunate enough to play against it, it's not going to be easy.

Rayeels: Unfavorable

If you can keep the Eels off the field early game, then you can still win, but they can OHKO anything on your field with just a few Eels are up. They can also OHKO Blastoise, which really hurts. The strategy is to drop as much energy as you can onto the field as soon as you have the Blastoise going, because of they KO it you could be in a very tight spot. There's not much else to say about this one; whoever keeps the energy flowing wins, and unfortunately Rayeels is better at doing that.

Garbodor Varients: Slightly Favorable

For starters, Garbodor is very inconsistent. Second, even if you don't run Tool Scrapper and they manage to get the ability lock off, so what? You can just catcher KO their Garbodor and then sweep their field. Mewtwo helps a lot in this matchup because if you are locked out of your acceleration, Mewtwo can attack with only two energy. True, if they can somehow keep the Garbodor up the entire match you could be in a tight spot, but the chances of that happening are slim and if you run Tool Scrapper this matchup is a walk in the park.

Mirror: Even

Well of course it's even, it's the same deck. This is one of those mirror matches that's almost pure luck. Whoever gets a Blastoise up first. attacks first, and gets more heads on SSU wins. Just don't make this mistake of going for a massive turn to OHKO one of their Keldeos, because a quick Mewtwo can put you in a really tight spot. Otherwise, just hope you go first and attack first, because luck and deckbuilding are the only things you have on your side in this.
 

Matryoshka

Hi, I'm a scrub
Member
It's too bad this deck loses to Rayeels, it would be the BDIF otherwise. The deck does have some nice Mewtwo abuse going on though. One Mewtwo goes a long way if they can't revenge it.
 

Ice

Returnee
Member
Matryoshka said:
It's too bad this deck loses to Rayeels, it would be the BDIF otherwise. The deck does have some nice Mewtwo abuse going on though. One Mewtwo goes a long way if they can't revenge it.

it doesn't lose to rayeels its weak to grass.
 

ctrl+alt+aria

Aces high
Member
hammer time! said:
Matryoshka said:
It's too bad this deck loses to Rayeels, it would be the BDIF otherwise. The deck does have some nice Mewtwo abuse going on though. One Mewtwo goes a long way if they can't revenge it.

it doesn't lose to rayeels its weak to grass.

Ray can OHKO anything with just 3 energy and it doesn't generally use {L} attackers anyways . They don't need grass and since Ray discards his energy Mewtwo can't XBall as high.
 

dmaster

Aspiring Trainer
Elite Member
Advanced Member
Member
Because trainer lock is non-existant and you don't really need a 2nd one with cards like Skyla, a whopping 4 Rare Candy and Computer Search in a deck?

dmaster out.
 

Puff-Sun

Gogoats
Member
Yeah it does, but that's why we have Bianca.
Let's talk Munna. I've found it to have immense potential as a tech in this deck. A little sleep goes a long way towards breaking your opponent's momentum, making Darkrai lose hard, and just being disruptive in general. It has great synergy with this deck, since as soon as you have 2 Keldeo out you're immune to LDH misfires, and there's no real drawback except giving the occasional Raikou something to kill, but you lose to RayEels anyway.
I also like how you didn't list Battle Strength Keldeo as a possible tech. It's the best Sigilyph counter this deck has, and it has the same 3-for-90 thing going that's so popular right now.
 

Blah

DBT
Member
Puff said:
Yeah it does, but that's why we have Bianca.
Let's talk Munna. I've found it to have immense potential as a tech in this deck. A little sleep goes a long way towards breaking your opponent's momentum, making Darkrai lose hard, and just being disruptive in general. It has great synergy with this deck, since as soon as you have 2 Keldeo out you're immune to LDH misfires, and there's no real drawback except giving the occasional Raikou something to kill, but you lose to RayEels anyway.
I also like how you didn't list Battle Strength Keldeo as a possible tech. It's the best Sigilyph counter this deck has, and it has the same 3-for-90 thing going that's so popular right now.

I understand your points, but this deck is so tight for space that there's seriously no room for those one or two techs. Blastoise handles Sigilpyh if you have to, and considering Sigilyph isn't that popular, the master rule of Consistency > Techs applies here.

As for Munna, it's entertaining, but may Darkrai decks tech Keldeo EX now to stop status lock and for free switches nowadays so it's often useless. It also requires a double coin flip to go your way, therefore making it too situational to be worth a precious deck spot, not to mention it's horrible to start with.

Keep in mind this is all based on extensive testing with many different lists of this deck (I even tried out Keldeo and Munna myself.)
 

dmaster

Aspiring Trainer
Elite Member
Advanced Member
Member
I absolutely love Keldeo #47 in this deck. Sure you will always have Blastoise against Sigilyph...but what do you do against one/two/three more that your opponent has (as well as other possible attackers like Mewtwo)? It's always nice to have a backup plan in case you don't want to use your Energy accelerator to attack (although I will agree Blastoise is a great option).

dmaster out.
 

Blah

DBT
Member
dmaster said:
I absolutely love Keldeo #47 in this deck. Sure you will always have Blastoise against Sigilyph...but what do you do against one/two/three more that your opponent has (as well as other possible attackers like Mewtwo)? It's always nice to have a backup plan in case you don't want to use your Energy accelerator to attack (although I will agree Blastoise is a great option).

dmaster out.

True, but it's rare that people play more than one Sigilyph (actually in your area, dmaster, I know there's a deck with two Sigilyph that does quite well, but for the metagame as a whole, it's odd to see it). This deck also revolves around overpowering the opponent, so even though Keldeo hits for the perfect 3 for 90 it's much better to attack with Keldeo EX for something like 110-170, not to mention that to get Keldeo active you'll have to burn two energy off of a Keldeo EX to retreat to it.

If your area plays a lot of Sigilyph, then I don't mind seeing Keldeo as a tech against that. Otherwise, I think it's much too situational for the few Sigilyph out there that can be taken down by Blastoise if you can't just catcher around it.
 

dmaster

Aspiring Trainer
Elite Member
Advanced Member
Member
Actually I was more referencing that Quad Sigilyph that won a Regionals because that could become popular as well.

But in fact, Keldeo #47 does basically 2HKO EXs and only gives up one Prize, so depending on the situation, it might be better to attack with it than Keldeo EX, as you ultimately win out on the Prize trade.

dmaster out.
 

derkmrtnz

Aspiring Trainer
Member
played keldeo/blastoise last weekend at a cities with 3 kyurem and loved it! kyurem softens up pokemon nicely for keldeo to get a easy ko.
 

RogueChomp

Team DBT
Member
Yanmega is actually a great great counter to this if used in a DCE abusing deck.
It OHKOs Squirtle, OHKOs Blastoise, takes only colorless, can stall, can set up Keldeo EX for a Darkrai snipe, and is a pretty easy to fit in.
Just watch out.
Cause Yanmega is coming to town.
This is serious btw^

Nice article! While I don't personally like the deck because sometimes it tends to be inconsistent late game, this will definitally help people looking to play the deck.
 

Infinity

Soccer Mom
Member
dmaster said:
Actually I was more referencing that Quad Sigilyph that won a Regionals because that could become popular as well.

But in fact, Keldeo #47 does basically 2HKO EXs and only gives up one Prize, so depending on the situation, it might be better to attack with it than Keldeo EX, as you ultimately win out on the Prize trade.

dmaster out.

No, Quad Sigilyph didn't win a Regionals.
 

Blah

DBT
Member
Infinity said:
dmaster said:
Actually I was more referencing that Quad Sigilyph that won a Regionals because that could become popular as well.

But in fact, Keldeo #47 does basically 2HKO EXs and only gives up one Prize, so depending on the situation, it might be better to attack with it than Keldeo EX, as you ultimately win out on the Prize trade.

dmaster out.

No, Quad Sigilyph didn't win a Regionals.

I think he was talking about a different country.
 

dmaster

Aspiring Trainer
Elite Member
Advanced Member
Member
There's a reason I didn't say U.S. Regional. ;p

Nevertheless, that does speak volumes that a deck can do that regardless of where it was played.

dmaster out.
 

Slowbro

Aspiring Trainer
Member
RogueChomp said:
Yanmega is actually a great great counter to this if used in a DCE abusing deck.
It OHKOs Squirtle, OHKOs Blastoise, takes only colorless, can stall, can set up Keldeo EX for a Darkrai snipe, and is a pretty easy to fit in.
Just watch out.
Cause Yanmega is coming to town.
This is serious btw^

Nice article! While I don't personally like the deck because sometimes it tends to be inconsistent late game, this will definitally help people looking to play the deck.
Only problem is it's a stage one.
 

Smeargle

.
Member
Infinity said:
dmaster said:
Actually I was more referencing that Quad Sigilyph that won a Regionals because that could become popular as well.

But in fact, Keldeo #47 does basically 2HKO EXs and only gives up one Prize, so depending on the situation, it might be better to attack with it than Keldeo EX, as you ultimately win out on the Prize trade.

dmaster out.

No, Quad Sigilyph didn't win a Regionals.
Quad sigilyph DID win Singapore regionals in the BW-BC format just recently.
 
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