Effectiveness of Educational Systems

Discussion in 'Beachfront Hangout' started by Chaos Jackal, Jun 2, 2013.

  1. Chaos Jackal Legend of the Past
    Chaos Jackal


    Discuss how well educational systems function, their purposes and whether they achieve it or not. Remember that not all countries have the same system, so do not rush to disregard one.
    All opinions, stories, examples etc. are welcome. This is a thread whose purpose is to look into and analyze how students view the system they belong to, what are its faults and how it could be improved.

  2. Haunted Water DEFT Lunar
    Haunted Water


    Here in America, we have a goverment-funded educational system called CORE. I don't know what it stands for, but I do know it is incredibly broken.
    I like challenges, and the system denied me challenges. I had the potential to be graduating cum laude, but because of the fact that they never listen to student demands*, I never got classes that I didn't have any prior knowedge in. I know math too well, and nearly slept in those classes (a feat I never thought I could do in the first place). lolGeometry class was interesting. My teacher said that if you do no more than one assignment per week, you won't pass. I sat back and said 'Challenge Accepted' aloud. End of the year came and I passed with a D+. ELA 11 was bad though. I had such a low grade I didn't take the final exam because 100% on it would leave me with 58% overall.
    Physics that year left me with a solid B. I didn't have to take the exam; I could've not taken it and passed the class with a 63%.
    I'm finishing out this Senior year with an overall cumulative GPA of 2.1, but not graduating. Why? Well, w/o ranting and just sparing you the details. I don't have the half-credit for Word History, and eventhough I have a total of 22.5 credits, which is graduation worthy because of the required minimum of 22 credits for graduation. So, I won't be going back to my high school in a hour to walk across a stage because I apparently aren't skilled enough.
    Overall, it's a good idea, but terribly executed. I get repetetiveness, but when an entire class is asking when this would ever be used irl, and the teacher's only answer is graduation, it's time to get rid of it.
    I tried to get help, too, but apparently my 504 only says 'lolADHD' because it did nothing for me.
    Bottomline: Education in America, espescially in Michigan, needs reformation. It doesn't need to be cut for your pockets you stupid politians. It needs to be fixed.
    Since I've been writing this for nearly 50 minutes, I'm going to stop here.
    Rally likes this.
  3. Juliacoolo Hi I'm Anthony, it's nice to meet you :) CLS '21

    Forum Head Forum Security Activities Head Badges Head Chat Room Head Website Staff Elite Member Advanced Member Member

    I think I have a skewed view of American public education, but I'll give my two cents.

    For some background info on my bias, I graduated valedictorian with a 4.7 GPA from a public school in suburban Ohio. School was never a considerable struggle for me, but I, just like any other student, had to endure my fair share of stressful days and late nights.

    There were two main factors that I accredit to my moderate success thus far: Interest and parenting. Parenting is the absolute biggest determinant of how successful one's child will be in today's environment. Not income, not intelligence, not location, but parenting. A family who relies on an education system to teach their child is dooming them. Unfortunately, many parents don't have time to teach their children.

    I grew up in a family on welfare and foodstamps, but my parents always were sure to make time for family and education. In fact, that's why we didn't have a lot of money. My mom stayed at home with us, and my dad had a mountain of debt from college.

    Parenting then leads to interest. A child who enjoys learning will succeed more than one who doesn't. This doesn't mean you necessarily enjoy school. All of us have had classes that we vehemently abhor. That's normal. Having a thirst for knowledge is what makes us move forward in life. Be it a musical, artistic, or athletic based, the intrinsic desire for growth is essential.

    Many will say that today's schools are simply shoving facts down our throats. They will say that they are getting rid of creativity and turning us into "drones". This is to some degree true, but is not the major problem in American education. It's the American lifestyle. Parents work full time, kids are left at the babysitter. A strong base that arouses genuine interest in education is what makes kids successful. American public education isn't great, but I do not believe it lacks the elements to foster success in our youth.
  4. PDC The PDC Show comes to an abrupt end...


    Make education an importance, stress the importance of an actual education. That is literally what I believe would be the simplest way to improve students grades. Tell them WHY.
    zappy800, One Approved and Juliacoolo like this.
  5. #1weavile I'm still alive =)


    Children are naturally curious.

    “When you take the free will out of education, that turns it into schooling.” ~ John Taylor Gatto

    PS: Anyone interested in voicing their opinions on schooling and education in general, we (Student Voice) have recently hosted our first event which was sponsored by Dell and hosted by Microsoft. Feel free to reach out: http://www.stuvoice.org
  6. Kecleon-X 124c41+


    The thing I find most disappointing are the illiterate college students.

    I mean, really? Weren't you supposed to learn that in kindergarten and first grade? Sheesh.
  7. Bo$$_89 Two Posts a Day Kept the Trolls Away


    We have the CORE crap here too. This stuff is supposed to be harder, but all it ones is make you write more. The exams even aren't covered by the curriculum, and what little is is repeated multiple times throughout the test. I'm a gifted student, and this doesn't even seem challenging for average students, just more work. The education system needs fixed, just not like this
    Haunted Water likes this.
  8. Polaris ...


    I don't care for the american public school system at all. I was apart of it for 5 years, left, went to a private school and now I'm a good student and I'm probably going to get somewhere. I'm not one to really try to correct anybody when it comes to schooling and education, none of us are, really. But something's broken for sure, be it the school system or people in general : P
  9. Pokequaza Aspiring Trainer


    In the Netherlands, there is little difference between private and public schools; they are equally good, or bad. This is probably due to an acceptable government when it comes to education, acceptable compared to the US equivalent by hearing your stories. I don't think it's huge problem whether a school is funded by the government or a private organisation.

    The main problem is the system itself; homework.

    I am not going to complain how much I dislike homework, in fact, practise is good, and it should be encouraged. The system deals with practise in a illogical way however; You go to school, listen to a teacher explaining the same things your textbook will also tell you. At the end of the day you return home, and you start working on your homework, the moment when there is nobody to help you out, and you actually need the help. This is, I think, one of the bigger problems when it comes to education.

    The solution; switch them around. You learn at home, and practise at schools where teachers walk around, and are able to help you out.

    (Dutch) Universities record most of their lectures for their students to re-watch, or watch it at home if they were unable to be present at the lecture. It is a great way of making information available to their students, and it would work as well for high schools. Record classes in advance, pupils can watch them at home, make notes (or whatever they do these days during classes), get to school, and start working on their schoolwork.
    Zeto likes this.
  10. Chaos Jackal Legend of the Past
    Chaos Jackal


    Well, since this seems to have generated some interest, I guess I'll contribute, too.
    In Greece, there is a 9-year compulsory education. After that, the students can either start working or follow three more years of schooling and then take a national exam to get into university. Note that at least 80-90% of the students continue with those three years.
    It's not the best system, but it could be tolerated if not for some serious issues. Firstly, school, especially the last 3, non-compulsory years, is viewed as a form of trials whose only purpose is to allow a student to get into university, effectively ruining the value of learning. Secondly, and largely due to parents, there is extra private tutoring. Obsessed with their children's "success", parents pass to them the logic of (or force them to) attending extra lessons. In other words, during the afternoon and evening, students do extra tutoring (and often quite expensive) with the sole purpose of increasing grades or preparing for the final exams when they're 18 (not learning). The insane thing is that such lessons begin from when the students are 13-14! And as a side effect, especially in later years, teachers tend to do bad or incomplete lessons in the belief that students have already done the topics in private lessons, proving disastrous to those few students who do not have extra tutoring. Overall, the whole system has been degraded to university preparation and a way for parents to brag about their children getting high marks. Disgusting. Add in the badly written books and the boring teaching methods, and you've got a nice combination that makes hell look appealing.
  11. Rusty Sticks ♪~ ᕕ(ᐛ)ᕗ
    Rusty Sticks


    I have a camera I use to record every lesson my teachers give. If I missed something while I was in the bathroom or just zoning out, going back to my videos helps me out.

    My Physics classmates thought it was stupid at first. I was the only one to pass the first major test (I got a 100 teehee). Started uploading them to Facebook, now everyone has an A.

    Feels good bro, helping everyone out.
  12. PDC The PDC Show comes to an abrupt end...


    Anybody else think that Rusty Sicks idea is like the one Cookie had in Ned's declassified where he would put a dummy with a camera.
  13. Rusty Sticks ♪~ ᕕ(ᐛ)ᕗ
    Rusty Sticks


    Funny. That's where I got the idea from.

    But I actually show up to class, and don't need a cardboard cutout to take my place.
  14. Athena Envoy of Mediation

    Advanced Member Member

    Public education in America failed me. I was accepted into IMSA's elementary school division, but my parents declined and sent me to public school so I could grow up like a "normal kid." They also didn't allow me to skip grades for the same reason. Even being in the school's "gifted program" I was not challenged at all when I was young. I loved learning and would read my textbooks from cover to cover (often way ahead of the class) , but was never challenged; homework and classwork was busy work and boring because "I already know all this; why do I have to write it down 5 more times?" So I slacked off and my grades went down; because my grades went down I wasn't allowed to take any higher level courses, and so I coasted through my entire education on a B average, bored as hell the entire time and literally sleeping through classes. At no point at any time did any teachers try to encourage me to do better or even do anything. I was just the quiet smart kid. I think my parents just thought I didn't like homework because kids aren't supposed to like homework.

    No, I'm not bitter at all. >_>
    Haunted Water and Chaos Jackal like this.
  15. PumpedAaron S Type Armor


    I don't think I know too much about all the politics behind the school system, but I DO have fond memories of most of the teachers in my life! My middle-school had plenty of friendly and funny teachers that I actually admired in some ways. One of my best friends and I were actually inspired to draw a cheap comic together inspired by our school life.

    The curriculum involves some entertaining or interactive element, too, like role-playing exercises, movies, field trips, etc.

    I think a lot of the teachers I've learned under have been generally advantageous. They usually have a great skill that stands out, such as a sense of humor, being able to connect theory with reality, being a holistic listener and responder in conversations, etc. Still though, when I go home, its really so difficult for me to harness that intrinsic motivation and do my homework.

    Sometimes it IS just me being lazy, but other times, I feel its my dad's disciplining tactics that squelch my sincere interest in learning. Now now, my parents are one of THE biggest reasons I'm a school boy in the first place. They always seemed to be obsessed with it ever since they started teaching me little bits of math and cursive writing when I was six!! Sometimes though, my parents try to persuade me to draw motivation from the fact that I need money to live, rather than the fact that I ENJOY art, psychology, science, etc, and that's a turn off so strong it pisses me off sometimes....

    However, I am starting to see that I need to think of my classes in terms of a target career, not just choosing something because its fun. But ideally, what's fun and what's my career should be the same!
  16. Uralya *ponders everything*


    I'm probably just crazy, but I enjoy the education system in my area. I was salutatorian of my freshman class this year with a 4.22 GPA (Jay, you really make me pale), and I never considered it hard, but rather engaging. I guess I was lucky to have a lot of hands-on teachers and not the nightmarish ones. I suppose I also enjoy work as a whole (as long as it isn't homework).

    My school system is rather encouraging save the lack of communication among sports teams, and I don't know how common that is. I haven't been exposed to enough different systems to say for sure, but I think I'm lucky to have such an interactive system. I wish the rest of this country would be like what I have to work with.

  17. Elite Stride ♫ I'm on the road to Viridian City ♫
    Elite Stride


    You want to know what's wrong with the damn education system? Well for starters I just took an economics final today and missed one point on it. Believe it or not, that one *@!%[email protected]%# point ruined by 4.0 GPA for this quarter. ONE POINT. The teacher uses a point system instead of a percentage system so my end of quarter grade calculates out to 94.75 points/100, which is .25 of a point away from a solid A. So to be even more correct.....I missed out on a 4.0 GPA because OF .25 OF A POINT. THAT is what's wrong with our education system.

    Like why do they even tell you to round your answers in math? Clearly that concept doesn't apply in real life.

    I'm so pissed right now >.<
  18. Equinox Stallwart Player


    Yes it's horrible. I moved back in 8th grade to another town and my sophomore year in science our teacher admitted our science that we were learning was 7th grade level. Seriously? There is a definite problem with education.
  19. Elite Stride ♫ I'm on the road to Viridian City ♫
    Elite Stride


    OK so apparently my teacher just decided to curve the grading scale so I got my A!! Woot!

    I take back everything I said about the education system. I was just mad cause I wasn't winning. Lol!


    But now that I think of it, there is one major underlying flaw with education. Unfortunately it's nearly impossible to correct. People's grades should depend on the course and how well they've mastered the material but a large portion of the time, teachers impact a persons grade more than anything. I hate the fact that two people can take the same exact course from two different instructors and end up with the same grade even though one person's teacher made them do 10 times the work and studying as the other. It gets even worse when you consider that one teacher might be offering loads of extra credit opportunities and things like that, and the other isn't.

    This "it's not fair argument" may seem childish at first but when you think about it, it can really put someone at a disadvantage in the long run. And it allows schools to theoretically hand out high GPA's to undeserving students. But as I said there's no way around it, so it's just one of those unfair facts about life that you have to deal with.
    Chaos Jackal and Haunted Water like this.
  20. CCloud Aspiring Trainer


    The fact that millions of students are expected to learn information and material the same way as everyone else using the same methods is an inherent flaw in education.

    Don't ask me how I propose to change that.
    Rally likes this.

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