'Battle Arena Decks: Xerneas vs. Yvetlal' Coming in October! [7/10]

I've been whining about how TPCi never released any precons beyond theme decks and world champ decks, and all I have to say, it is about time.

I hope they are actually new decks, and not Resilient life vs Destruction rush. That would be very sad.

I would like it if TPCi did a red genesect collection and this thing every year.
 
I actually suspect, given the timing, this will be when we receive the english versions of Xerneas and Yveltal that Japan is getting in those packs that are being released with Diancie and the Cocoon of Destruction. It makes sense as both of their attacks get stronger if the opponent has the opposite Pokemon on their side of the field. Especially if Japan gets their product with the alternate artwork we got with our Xerneas/Yveltal EX tins, as it would make no sense for us to get those yet again...though tell that to the Mega Charizard boxes that will have the same promo as the Charizard EX box :(

This makes me think we will see the movie here about August/September and that Diancie will be in the US release of Phantom Gate.
 
That would be cool but I doubt that one. Though with the Genesect one I suppose it's possible. Actually that would be neat, a basic (at least) half fairy deck. I'd want it to be part water and have the Goodra line in it...come to think of it there is a Goodra promo that was released in Japan that we don't have.
 
Whatever the case might be, all I want to see is more vs precons, all holo precons, and precons with an EX or any ultra rare equivalent card as the featured card.

All I am saying is that for every year, there should be a set of special preconstructed decks released. Last year was Red Genesect collection, and this year it is the Battle Arena Decks. I could also lump the Trainer kit as part of the special decks as well as the world champ decks, but I just feel the fact that world champ decks have the different card back, and I don't know, I just don't know how to explain it. It just doesn't count for me.

Next stop, precons that teach people how to play Pokemon TCG differently, whether it be rotation battles, 3 vs 3, 2 vs 2, team battle etc.

Has TPCi even considered creating a $50 competitive precon? MTG did a $75 Modern Event Deck, and Konami is going to do a $50 all holo noble knight precon.
 
Actually I agree with you, the world championship decks don't count, at least I don't think so. Its because you can't use them except with someone else using those decks or with permission, and all of that would only be casual play, it would never happen in competitive plays.

I don't see any EX variant decks, but I could see some 'special' card that isn't part of a set as the main variant card. It's also a good way to release alternate holos of cards besides in blister packs.
 
I was kind of saying that they should do the same thing they did when they did the epic collection decks back in 2007. Do you remember the ones with Meganium ex, Typhlosion ex, and Feraligatr ex? Basically like that, but do it with the current generation of ultra rares.

I hate to admit it, but I am a collector. A precon collector. I collect precons for MTG, YGO, and Pokemon. If it is a precon in some shape or form that isn't semi-random nor random, and the random components are separate, like in an included booster, or a power up pack, then it is fair game.

I kind of have some restrictions through. The precons must be purchasable, that is, it isn't one of those convention only products, or a product where you have to hand in some promotional flyer. I am debating whether the world champ decks should count because of the different card back, and without any Pokemon precons besides theme decks, I would have to count them. I was kind of pissed when they released the Kalos Starter set. It kind of messes with my collection when I see the missing Legendary Treasures theme decks, and instead we got the Kalos Starter set. Anyway, in your opinion, would you lump them with the theme decks, or would you categorize them as special precons? I kind of wished they did Legendary Treasures theme decks, and made the Kalos Starter set as special precons.

I really hope TPCi continues what they did with the red genesect collection and this product, as well as revive 2007's epic collection. I just can't wait before this gets released. I also hope that TPCi releases special precons annually. Something like 2 vs decks a year, where the trainer kit takes the spot of one of the vs decks, a set of 3 or so precons with ultra rares as the cover card in the middle of the year, and an all holo precon box set in the end of the year.

We also had something like this back in 2005. Anyone remember the Battle Stadium Blaziken vs Gardevoir?

The reason why I stress TPCi should make precons beyond theme decks, and world champ decks don't really count, is that MTG has intro packs, event decks, duel decks, clash packs, commander decks, and some multiplayer variant precons released in an annual basis. YGO has starter decks and structure decks, so would feel that Pokemon needs a precon type of product that is not categorized under theme decks, and has the tournament legal card back. Whether it be vs decks, or all holo decks, or decks that contain EX cards as the cover card, it is fair game. This is a good start, and I really do hope we see more of these in an annual basis, along with the epic collection decks. The all holo deck, well, I don't mind if it doesn't happen every year.

On the downside, the more precons there are, the more cash I have to spend haha.
 
I actually remember the Blaziken vs. Gardevoir thing, I did get it because of some differences in that set from Ruby/Sapphire.

I remember the EX kits that had the Johto starters. That I didn't get because, at least iirc, there was nothing in there that wasn't already out. I collect too, but differently. To get my attention a product needs to have some new card(s) in it, even if we're just talking alternate artwork. I personally hate it when a 'new' product is released with all cards that are out already that look exactly the same. Thankfully that doesn't happen to often in Pokemon. To use your Yugioh example though, there were the Yugi/Kaiba decks that have been released at least three times (regular, evolution and the latest ones I believe) and aside from a couple 'unique' cards that could have been released another way they had nothing new in them. To me those were a waste. Of course I'm not really a theme deck collector. The closest I get are cards that aren't holo in the normal set or cards that are rare in normal set and holo in the theme deck (refer to Mewostick and Heliolisk for example).

The Red Genesect one is a good example because it gave us a new card, regardless of whether or not the rest of the cards were from other sets and were regular or reverse holo. I do kind of wish we had gotten Legendary Treasures theme decks too, that is only the second time in american Pokemon history where they hadn't done at least two theme decks, the first being Neo Revelations for those who remember that far back.
 
Well the Yugi Reloaded and Kaiba reloaded does have Dark Magician and Blue Eyes White Dragon as ultimate rares, and I don't think I have seen them as ultimate rares haha.

In a way, the Blaziken vs Gardevoir also had a "side deck" that has cards that are good with team battles.

Would you like it if the main set had one exclusive EX card that is only found in a precon? Let's say that every set had a precon whose cover card is an EX card, and let's call this a deluxe deck. Would you like it if that EX card was from the main set, but is only found in the deck? If you don't like it exclusive to the deck, would you like it if they did something where it was alternate art?

Looking at Pokemon vs MTG, their product lineups are almost similar.

Each set has associated theme decks. Pokemon usually has 2, while MTG used to have 4, and now have 5. Their theme decks are intro packs.

MTG used to have the world champ decks since 1999, but they discontinued them in 2004. Pokemon started them in 2004. 2004 was the only year where MTG and Pokemon had world champ decks.

MTG had the core game or starter set, which contained 2 decks, and 2 booklets with step by step instructions on how to play the game. They have done this 3 times, in 2001, 2003, and 2005, and they have stopped doing them. The Trainer kit is similar to this product.

Starting with Magic 2015, they have clash packs. I could say they are also similar to the trainer kits, but only for the fact that they are 2 decks in which you can combine together. In the case of the trainer kit, there are 2 30 card decks, and you can combine them to make a 60 card deck. As for the clash packs, you have 2 60 card decks, and there are decklists for both decks separately, and a decklist for how the deck becomes competitive when they are combined.

MTG's fat pack and Pokemon's elite trainer box is similar.

The red genesect collection is to MTG's premium deck series. The PDS is now discontinued, and they have ever done it 3 times.

MTG has event decks, and the epic collection sort of fills that void, considering how an EX card could make the deck competitive, as well as having pokemon from multiple sets, as opposed to theme decks where they are all from one set. So to make a product similar to the event deck, the cover card must be an EX card from the same set the decks are based on, and they have the same packaging as the deluxe kalos starter set decks. The deluxe deck packaging shows 3 cards, and they would show the EX card, and 2 rare holos. Another way they can package this is to show the EX card, an important non EX pokemon, and an important Trainer card. The deck would cost $25. (Japan has precons in which the cover card is an EX card and the epic collection decks had ex cards as cover cards, so I don't see why TPCi won't do something like this). People may complain that people who buy these decks have an unfair advantage in that they buy the deck, rather than build it, but with MTG's event decks, whose sole purpose is to give a "competitive" deck to people who go to Friday Night Magic without a deck, from what I hear from the fanbase, the decks don't win all the games, and is more used as a launching point for a competitive deck. So doing something similar to this for Pokemon would be cool. Make the deck competitive, but make it so that you probably win 10% to 25% of the time in a tournament. In the case where the set does not have an ultra rare equivalent card, the window would show a second important holo rare pokemon.

Now that this product is announced, this product would be analagous to MTG's duel decks. I am thinking that one of the decks is made and built to defeat the other deck, and is in no way going to be competitive.

In your opinion, do you think the 2 player starter set trainer kit is a popular product? How about the world champ decks? What about the Red Genesect collection? MTG says that those kinds of product aren't popular, which is why they don't exist. I think the 4 world champ decks should just transform into epic deluxe decks, where they are set associated, and they release one with each set.

Would you like it if the world champ decks were replaced by competitive legal precons that only win 10% to 25% of the time in small tournaments? Kind of like MTG's event decks? Another feature of MTG"s event decks are that they are exclusive to hobby stores. So maybe the precons I suggest can be exclusive to hobby stores as well.
 
I've seen enough of Yugioh to know they could have randomly thrown in Ultimate rares of Dark Magician and Blue Eyes White Dragon in some random extra set, like Legendary Collections or something. I've done some Yugioh collecting, in fact at one point I was a 'Ghost master', meaning I had all of the Ghost rares from the sets though I lost that 'title' a few sets back, Star Eater being the last one I got. I also collect Dark Magicians (and associated cards like Paladin, Dark Magician Girl, etc) and Blue Eyes (and associated cards, I think there is one promo that just came out that I don't have). In fact they had a Legendary Collection Yugi not long ago iirc that at least Ultimate rare Dark Magician could have been in. There are also Stardust Dragon and Red Archfiend Dragon parts that I think I am now missing. And all of those were JUMP promos I believe.

I forgot about the side deck in the B vs G decks...though I doubt it would happen I'd like to see a part 2 of that with exclusive Blaziken EX, Gardevoir EX, M. Blazkien EX and M. Gardevoir EX. When they com in set M. Blaziken could be fighting and M. Gardevoir could be fairy, but in the part 2 set they could be fire and psychic respectively. Heh, that'd be awesome :)

Actually yes I would find it kind of cool to have an EX that is only in preconstructed decks, Japan does it all the time (ex. Combustion Wing Charizard EX). I know it most likely won't happen though. Or something that is alternate art in it, that would be fine by me. I just think something 'new' is a good thing, even if it's just by the look of it. Sometimes the alternate artwork is better than the set artwork, for example Yveltal EX. I like the tin artwork better than the set artwork. Let's also not forget we have like five different versions of Outrage Reshiram/Zekrom, and I have them all (again as an example).

Admittedly I know next to nothing about Magic, aside from the fact it was the first card game ever released. I used to play the second card game that was ever released (at least to my knowledge).
 
The problem with the beach and the gym community is that they aren't open to new things. Side decks? Stupid idea. 3 vs 3? Stupid idea. Discontinuing the world champ decks? stupid idea, well I guess it is a stupid idea if people still buy them. Do something different with the game? Stupid idea. New product idea? Stupid idea.

In the Pokegym forums, there is this guy who works at TPCi who posts in those forums, and I guess he saw my "whining" of wanting something like a vs deck, and this is probably the fruits of my "whining". If I wasn't there, stuff like this would have never existed. Elite trainer boxes would have never existed, considering how I whined about how you can't get basic energy cards unless there are stores that specialize in Pokemon near you, and that basic energy cards were only available in theme decks, and not all theme decks have the energy you want. In order to get all 8, at the time, basic energy types, you had to buy 4 theme decks, and you only got around 9 of each for $50. Basic energy should be the card that is the easiest to get no matter where you live, and as such they should be worthless value wise that you won't feel bad for ripping them, burning them, or making a house of cards out of them. If I didn't "whine", all we would have were theme decks, booster packs, and all box sets would contain booster packs or theme decks, rather than some new product, like a completely different preconstructed deck, which they have rectified with the red genesect collection.

I hope in the future, that TPCi releases less box sets, but in place of them, release special precons, special booster packs, like they did with dragon vault, etc. I guess I can say I am complaining about how there are so many box sets, that all contain the same booster packs, but they have different promos on them.

Don't you agree that there are way to many box sets or blisters, that contain XY or XY flashfire booster packs or any main set booster packs that you could have otherwise bought individually, and the only thing that is different is the promo card, and you would like to see more original content in box sets, similar to Red Genesect collection, Dragon Vault, or the Battle Arena vs decks?

One of the product suggestions I made was to make a booster set that isn't part of the main 4 booster sets. With Pokemon TCG products, I tend to categorize them as main products and side products. Main products would be the 4 booster sets that are released and the 2 theme decks that come with them. Everything else is side product. So what I suggested was a side product booster set, that contains reprinted cards, and the entire set is made with drafting and sealed play in mind. Just think of YGO's battle packs, but for Pokemon TCG.
 
I like alot of the cards that come in those set/blisters, like the recently released Krookodile EX box and something like that would be good, they could have released Krookodile EX in some kind of preconstructed theme deck (hey a theme deck with an EX, it works like in Japan lolz). And really, even for those who don't really worry about preconstructed theme decks, honestly they're still not any more or less 'useless' than the cards pulled from the packs in the box. I mean there comes a time when even pulling a third Skarmory EX is a useless pull, never mind the millionth Jigglypuff (I speak from experience) and lately decks come with cool looking (if not kind of cheap) deck boxes. I think those are neat little decorations for my dresser.

In fact at one point they kind of did that stuff when they had POP packs, which had 9 different releases. Those have been gone since sometime in the D/P/P era though. Originally most of those were for league which I could never find. Eventually they found a few other ways, and of course there was ebay.

Maybe it's part of Yugioh but I like the idea of side decks (though in truth I rarely used one anyway but understood the purpose of it). In fact there was a ccg that despite it being dead for years I and several others worked to continue expanding and stuff, and there was at least one side deck I proposed that would have made some of the more 'useless' cards more playable. I also see nothing wrong with 3 vs 3, it's already in the Pokemon video game. The one major drawback I could see is that it would make each turn even longer, but that's only a small thing imo. I remember an old article that had basic rules for a Pokemon version of War. I thought it was fun and very easy to play.
 
I wasn't really talking about side decks, but more like side products. For YGO, for me at least, would be any booster set released in the OCG and it's TCG counterpart that is part of the 8 color booster rainbow pattern, as well as the 2 structure decks and the one starter deck that is released both in the OCG and TCG. Everything else would be a side product, whether it be the TCG exclusive starter of structure decks, (You can argue that it is a main product if you don't count the OCG), battle packs, legendary collection, dragons of legend type booster packs, tins, etc.

For Pokemon TCG, a main product is the 4 booster sets that they release every year. Examples would be XY, XY Flashfire, Black and White Legendary Treasures, Plasma Blast etc. The 2 theme decks that come with the set are also main products. It is hard to figure out whether kalos starter set is a main or a side product, considering how Legendary Treasures never had theme decks, and how these are supposed to be the replacement.

There are side products in the Pokemon TCG, but they are either not legal in tournaments, like the world champ decks, or they contain any combination of the main products packaged into one box + one or more single promo cards. What I would like to see are actual side products, whether they be precons or booster packs, and not something where they bundle different main products in a box + one single promo. I am not saying that they should discontinue box sets, I am just saying that they should do less of them, and in place, make completely brand new precons or a specialized booster set, whether they be a set built for draft, or a very small all-holo set, like they did with dragon vault.

So all in all, less box sets, more products like these. I basically made up my own schedule as to what TPCi should release as an annual basis. This is one of those things.

Main booster sets and their associated theme decks are released in February, May, August, and November.

In March and September, they normally release the tins.

In April and October, they should release the battle arena vs decks.

In December, they should release the all holo precon deck like the red genesect collection.

In June, they should release a set of 3 precons costing $25 that contains an EX card as a cover card, typically, each one contains an EX card from one of each of the any of the main sets released the previous year, so if something like this released this June, it would contain one EX card from either Plasma Storm, Plasma Freeze, Plasma Blast, or Legendary Treasures, most likely those that haven't been released in Tins before, or maybe just release a set of brand new exclusive to this precon EX cards. Another thing about these decks, is that unlike theme decks, they contain pokemon cards from multiple sets. Theme decks contain cards that are only from their set, with the exception of trainers, which can be from any set so long as they are in the same series. These are different. As long as at time of release, the card is standard legal, it is fair game. As I said before, these would be in the same packaging as the Kalos Starter set deluxe decks, which means they contain one random booster from the last few latest sets, and due to the nature of the packaging, being able to see 3 cards and all, the featured cards should all be black star promo alternate art EX card, Rare holo pokemon, and a holo trainer card.
 
I hate to bump this, but I thought I would like to share something with you.

I just realized something. Last year, we had Red Genesect collection. This year, we have some sort of Xerneas vs Yveltal battle arena decks. What do both of them have in common with respect to the years they are released in? Does it have something to do with movies?

Next, according to bulbapedia anyway, the red genesect we got in the red genesect collection was based off the japanese genesect promo in the movie commemoration genesect set. In Japan, there exists a movie commemoration xerneas set, and a movie commemoration yveltal set. What this could possibly mean is that whatever Xerneas and Yveltal cards are in those sets, are going to be in this product.

Even if they aren't going to do all the things I suggest they do, I predict what they would possibly do is to an annual precon that ties into the movie. I am pretty sure Japan will have some movie commemoration set tied in with each movie, and whatever card is the featured card in those sets, TPCi would possibly create a precon product with those featured cards. If there wasn't a movie commemoration set released in Japan, I highly think that TPCi should continue making precons tied to the movie, and make sure, unlike that red genesect collection, that both trainers and pokemon come from multiple expansions. Red Genesect collection fails in this because it is just a glorified Mind Wipe theme deck, rather than a brand new deck.
 
Actually there is one way that the Red Genesect deck redeems itself, all of the card are reverse holo. No other preconstructed/theme deck in current history can say that.

I could see annual products based on the movie. Japan has been doing that since at least Heroes (with Latias/Latios) we just never got it before the Darkrai with the Enigma Berry promo for Rise of Darkrai. Even that isn't the same level as preconstructed decks. I have already predicted the Xerneas and Yveltal cards will be based off of the promo cards that will be released on July 19th, though rather this is the case or not we do not yet know.
 
Yeah, but the fact that the red genesect collection is so similar to Mind Wipe theme deck just kills it, and making it all reverse holo just won't redeem it. In a way, we did get some form of preconstructed deck based off the movie, but they are simply just set associated theme decks for Great Encounters, Platinum, Arceus, Next Destines, and Boundaries Crossed. What I hope for is that they make special preconstructed decks for the movies, rather than just making them set associated theme decks. Another thing is that every year must have at least 8 set associated theme decks with 2 set associated theme decks per set, meaning that these special precons are to not replace the set associated theme decks, like how the kalos starter sets replaced legendary treasures theme decks.
 
Well the practical use of theme decks not withstanding, for those who have tried to 'bling' out their decks they know it being all reverse holo is a pretty nice start anyway. That's one of those to each their own situations. I myself only vaguely recognized the similarties.

I don't count the regular set theme decks we got at the same time as the movie releases (ie your list above) either, I was referring to the Japanese half decks, like the one in Heroes that had the holo Alto Mare's Latias and Alto Mare's Latios, as well as Annie's Espeon and Oakley's Ariados (I think, it might be the other way around) what was once referred to as VS cards. This went on in half deck form until the 9th movie after that it was just random commemoration sets, but because at the time the idea of named Pokemon after the gym sets or having evovled Pokemon as basics (what would later become SP Pokemon) was frowned on.
 
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