OU: Pokémon Aegislash Discussion Thread

Professor Palutena

Professor Palutena

The Queen
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Because the more bacon ripoffs, the better.

681Aegislash.png


Typing: Steel/Ghost
Ability: Stance Change (This Pokemon changes its stance depending on the moves it uses)

Base Stats:
Shield Stance: 60 / 50 / 150 / 50 / 150 / 60
Sword Stance: 60 / 150 / 50 / 150 / 50 / 60

Aegislash is probably one of the most interesting Pokemon to come out of this generation due to Stance Change. Having the ability to switch between a powerful defensive threat, and a powerful offensive threat at will is a very interesting trait that makes the Pokemon flexible. While the Steel-type isn't as good of a defensive type as it once was, Steel/Ghost is a really good defensive typing.

Note on the ability. Aegislash always begins in Shield stance. If you use any attacking move, you will change to Sword stance. Otherwise, it will stay in Shield stance. The only way to go from Sword stance to Shield stance is to use King's Shield.

Possible Movesets

StanceDance
Aegislash @ Leftovers
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpA
Adamant Nature
- King's Shield
- Swords Dance
- Shadow Sneak
- Sacred Sword / Iron Head / Shadow Ball

By using King's Shield and Swords Dance, Aegislash can set up on Pokemon that uses a lot of contact moves. The idea is to gradually set up on something that doesn't threaten you, which is surprisingly a lot due to Stance Change. Set up and then sweep.

3 Attacks
Aegislash @ Leftovers
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpA
Quiet / Adamant Nature
- King's Shield
- Shadow Ball
- Shadow Sneak
- Iron Head / Sacred Sword

By forgoing Swords Dance in favor of another offensive move, Aegislash is able to hit a wider variety of threats, and yet stay perfectly safe behind the King's Shield. Shadow Ball is important on this set, as it 2HKOs Skarmory, Gliscor and Hippowdon, all of which otherwise wall the set. Use Iron Head to pick off the special sponges that resist Shadow Ball, such as Sylveon and Togekiss, as well as Tyranitar. Sacred Sword hits Tyranitar, Blissey and Bisharp.

DoubleDance
Aegislash @ Leftovers
EVs: 88 HP / 252 Atk / 168 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Autotomize
- Shadow Claw
- Sacred Sword / Iron Head

A double dance set makes Aegislash a prime late game Pokemon, being able to outspeed base 130s after a Autotomize. Use the set up move that fits the situation, with Autotomize for Heavy Offense and Swords Dance for Stall. Given Aegislash's bulk, it's possible you could set up both.

Mixed
Aegislash @ Spooky Plate / Life Orb
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 SpA / 4 HP
Quiet Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Shadow Sneak
- Iron Head
- Sacred Sword

Meet the best wallbreaker in OU. Due to Aegislash' Ghost type, awesome offensive stats, and great coverage, Aegislash is able to pave the way for a numerous Pokemon needing a sweep. The set can eliminate Garchomp, Goodra, Togekiss, Tyranitar, Sylveon, Excadrill and Volcarona, among others. Numerous Pokemon appreciate having these threats removed, including most Dragon-types.

So what do you guys think of Aegislash?
 
I love Aegislash, it has a great ability, and it is just interesting to use in general. Curious, when you switch forms, do the EVs switch? Let's say you put X amount of EVs on defense, would they switch to attack when changed to sword form or would they stay on defense?
 
No, they do not.

Anyways, I'm absolutely loving the pseudo mixed Aegislash. People expect a shadow sneak but then I pop off a nice Shadow ball. It's so hard to play around too. I hate having to look straight at an Aegislash, I will admit that much.
 
MuhFugginMoose said:
No, they do not.

Anyways, I'm absolutely loving the pseudo mixed Aegislash. People expect a shadow sneak but then I pop off a nice Shadow ball. It's so hard to play aound too.
I hate having to lookm sraight at a an Aegislash, I will admit that much.
Click to expand...

And that, my friends, is why my Aegislash does barely any damage, but can survive anything.
 
I'll be honest. I think people use Aegislash the wrong way and their opponents handle Aegislash the wrong way, which makes it appear to be so good at what it does. About 85% of all the Aegislash on Showdown in the last week of October (when Smogon posted the usage stats) used the StanceDance strategy - this is one of its worst movesets in my opinion. Aegislash is meant to be played aggressively as a pivot that can deal huge scars of damage, not a sweeper. An Aegislash sitting on Swords Dancing and hiding behind King's Shield is both a sitting duck and utterly predictable if you know how to handle it right. King's Shield is a poor man's Protect, and the attack reduction threat can be seen from miles away. It's no wonder the better Aegislash player wins when StanceDance sets collide - whoever predicts the King's Shield wins. You may argue that it has all the coverage it needs, but it is much more easily walled and also predictable due to this. King's Shield and Swords Dance are both moves that may have their uses but are either too predictable or wasted on such a Pokémon as Aegislash. Instead, a good Aegislash is one that stays aggressive and provides hole-punching power while pivoting and keeping momentum - don't forget that switching out reverts it back to Shield Forme, and for this reason you can forego King's Shield with little repercussion. This doesn't mean that Choice Band is by any means a good choice - on the contrary, it's worse than StanceDance. Mixed and 3-Attacks Aegislash are far more flexible and unpredictable than those two sets. King's Shield is justifiable as a move in itself if one feels the need to keep Aegislash in, and it is more important than Swords Dance in my opinion, but the hype of those two moves has compromised the effectiveness of the StanceDance set. The idea behind Aegislash's strengths is to come in on an easy attack and punish. Punish. Punish.

A big reason that StanceDance looks so good in practice is because people handle Aegislash wrongly. This set loses a lot of momentum every time it comes in, but it is only capitalized on by better players. They just fall right into the King's Shield shenanigans and fail to pressure Aegislash. Aegislash, while it may not have the speed or the staying power to set-up sometimes, is not a Pokémon to try to take out by force - you need to constantly apply pressure to it, force it out, and capitalize on the momentum of those maneuvers. A beautiful example of this is Rotom-W. Not only can this little machine handle Talonflame and Greninja, but it can also do the aforementioned to Aegislash. This isn't done through sheer force but by threat. Rotom-W doesn't care in the slightest about King's Shield. This sucker has Will-o-Wisp, Thunder Wave and Pain Split. It can play all kinds of games against Aegislash, ironically a Pokémon that gives the illusion that it can play games itself the way it's used. A Pokémon like Charizard is an example of what not to send in against a good Aegislash. You might think it a good move, and typically it is, but when you take upwards of 70% from a +SAtk LO Shadow Ball and then get murdered by a Shadow Sneak, you come crying back to the drawing board. Aegislash is played the wrong way in this respect, and it gives the illusion this time that you can just switch in something that resists moves of the typical Aegislash and expect to be fine. This is why we think the StanceDance set is so good - while it might have great potential, it is insanely predictable and often punishable, but few actually know how to pressure Aegislash into doing nothing. A good player can force an Aegislash out with a good play. You need to apply that pressure and deny Aegislash the room or time to set-up and fool around with King's Shield, but it so rarely happens that StanceDance is glorified among its sets.

In short, I am appalled by how we use Aegislash and how we handle that use when paired against it. Face it, Aegislash is a real threat, I won't deny that, but its major claim-to-fame is nothing short of hype.

The Aegislash sets that I find useful are the mixed set (Shadow Ball, Shadow Sneak, Sacred Sword, Iron Head), the 3-Attacks set (KS, Shadow Sneak, Sacred Sword, Iron Head, Shadow Ball, etc.),the 3-Attacks Special set (KS, Flash Cannon, Shadow Ball, HP Ice, etc.) and the Autotomize set (Autotomize, Flash Cannon, Shadow Ball, HP Ice, etc.).

~AoH
 
Riskbreakers said:
Does Shadow Ball + Shadow Sneak on the wallbreaker set KO all the mentioned threats described?
Click to expand...

I believe it covers all but Tyranitar, but it's pretty easy to see how that's handled. I did calcs for Garchomp and Togekiss and can verify that they are 2HKOed by SB+SS (Garchomp needs one round of SR damage to guarantee). The rest are pretty reasonable without needing damage calcs.

Also, on the 3 Attacks set, Sylveon and Togekiss do not resist Shadow Ball at all.

~AoH
 
Agreeing with AoH. Stance Dance is super easy to play around, and I find it to be really outclassed by the Spooky Plate set.

Spooky Plate set seems like a really good partner with a Dragon, as it eliminates pretty much every Fairy type. Maybe I should pair it with Salamence or Dragonite. Is Multiscale Dragonite available now?
 
Astra said:
Agreeing with AoH. Stance Dance is super easy to play around, and I find it to be really outclassed by the Spooky Plate set.

Spooky Plate set seems like a really good partner with a Dragon, as it eliminates pretty much every Fairy type. Maybe I should pair it with Salamence or Dragonite. Is Multiscale Dragonite available now?
Click to expand...

Yup. I've got a Marvel Scale Dragonair from the Friend Safari for in-game verification.

The mixed set is definitely where Aegislash shines - it showcases its true role as an offensive pivot. Pairing it with a Dragon partner makes perfect sense, but take into account the nerf of Outrage and the presence of Fairies like Azumarill. Outrage is still very viable, as unsheathed so adamantly relayed to us in the Speculation Thread, but if using Dragon Claw, the dragon will lack a bit of power. Aegislash can soften things up for the dragon(s) before bowing out.

Aegislash's typing may synergize perfectly with Hydreigon, but Blaziken walks all over these two, so I don't exactly advocate their pairing. Salamence, Dragonite, and Excadrill stand out as partners to me because the dragons can set up on Aegislash's checks and clear out holes Aegislash has punched while Excadrill is a definite answer to Rotom-W, Aegislash's number one counter in my opinion. Exca can also spin for the dragon and keep Spikes/SR from wearing Aegislash down, as in its best role it will be switching in a lot.

~AoH
 
That Excadrill pairing could work even better once PokeBank comes out as a possible Stealth Rock/Rapid Spin set could work really well, as Aegislash can also spinblock.

It needs something for Blaziken though. Azumarill could work.
 
I just want to point out that the first one says 252 SpAtk even though that set doesn't run Shadow Ball.

I also agree with pretty much everything AoH said in his first post. I've seen Aegislash a lot on the ladder, but only once or twice have I seen anything other than Swords Dance, and I feel people play it really predictably. It hasn't been hard for me to play around unless it's ran Shadow Ball, and I agree that the mixed sets are much better.
 
RogueChomp said:
Will Blaziken even be tournament legal?
Click to expand...

It is right now. Pre-PokeBank OU only has Mewtwo, Xerneas and Yveltal banned.

True Astra, Excadrill getting SR really helps out the combo. Can't be stated more concisely.

As for Blaziken, I've typically looked little further than Rotom-W, again. Rotom-W forces Blaziken to use the highly exploitable Hi Jump Kick, which says free switch-in for Aegislash to threaten an OHKO with Shadow Sneak back. Sure, this won't work every time, especially against skilled players, but Rotom-W also has access to T-Wave and even Protect to force a miss (lol). Azumarill also works, even better offensively than Rotom-W. I'd just prefer Rotom-W due to the overall Talonflame weakness of that core.

Aegislash is a team player, evidently. It fits a myriad of roles and covers a spectrum of synergy with popular partners. I like that aspect of it too.

~AoH
 
Question:

Is King Shield the only move that puts Aegislash in "Defense Mode", or is it any move with the Status distinction, e.g. Swords Dance?

...also, there's nothing wrong with King Shield in and of itself, though since Protect is rare in Singles, it lacks presence. (In VGC, however, it'll be staple.)
 
DNA said:
Question:

Is King Shield the only move that puts Aegislash in "Defense Mode", or is it any move with the Status distinction, e.g. Swords Dance?

...also, there's nothing wrong with King Shield in and of itself, though since Protect is rare in Singles, it lacks presence. (In VGC, however, it'll be staple.)
Click to expand...

King's Shield and switching are the only things that will put Aegislash back into Shield Forme.

There isn't a thing wrong with King's Shield itself, true. It's about how it's used. Singles, pretty predictable (Protect has a few key uses in singles, but they are very niche). Doubles, well, must-have.

~AoH
 
That it? Darn.

Personally, my favorite of the sets is the 3 Attacks one. It's the one my friend uses and works quite well; KS is mostly for switching back to 150 Defenses. Protect is just the perk.

Stance Dance is just bad; Aegislash has no business using SD. As was said, it's a pivot, not a sweeper.
 
I've also tried a rather weird Aegislash set with Weakness Policy. By focusing a bit more on Aegislash's defenses you can practically pull out a Growth in the sun, which also means you can run 3 or even 4 offensive moves (if you wanna drop King's Shield). It's not exactly great, but it has a surprise factor and it's really fun to see Sucker Punchers getting OHKO'ed by their own type coverage :).
 
I would like to get some ideas on using Aegislash as part of a defensive core in a way. I realize that it loses all pretenses of being defensive when it switches out of shield form, but maybe it could be used with more defense (or special defense) investment to surprise people and switch into things that would normally give it trouble. Then it would still be able to hit hard because of its base 150 special/attack. I'm not sure if this is viable, but it seemed to work pretty well when I paired it with an Assault Vest T-tar and a specially defensive Zapdos as a defensive core. Any thoughts, or is this a horrible misuse of Aegislash's abilities?
 
I think the big problem with defensive Aegislash is the lack of non-Rest recovery, and that your only way to be offensive with the 150/150 defenses is Toxic.

I could see it working with Toxic Spikes support though, as Aegislash can stop the opponent from spinning them away.
 
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