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Standard [Future 2017 Format] M Rayquaza and Jolteon EX

Swampert Fan 101

Swampert Fan 101

I liek Swampertz
Member
Hello everyone! For the 2017 format Primal Clash on is legal, which means Rayquaza loses getting Emerald Break in the first turn it is played (r.i.p Battle Compressor). Two of Rayquza's main threats (Night March, and Vespiquen) have either been rotated out or have been slowed down a lot. This leads many people to believe Rayquaza is going to be one of the best decks. All and any suggestions will be welcome.

Pokemon:14
  • 3 Rayquaza EX (XY 66)
  • 2 M Rayquaza EX (ROS 76)
  • 1 Swablu (ROS 73)
  • 1 Altaria (XY 46)
  • 2 Hoopa EX (XY 71)
  • 2 Shaymin EX (ROS 77)
  • 1 Zorua (BKT 90)
  • 1 Zoroark (BKT 91)
  • 2 Jolteon EX (GEN 28)
Trainers/Supporters/Stadiums: 30
  • 4 Professor Sycamore
  • 2 Lysandre
  • 1 Winona
  • 4 Ultra Ball
  • 4 VS Seeker
  • 3 Trainers' Mail
  • 1 Pokemon Fan Club
  • 2 Float Stone
  • 3 Sky Field
  • 2 Mega Turbo
  • 2 Rayquaza Sprit Link
  • 1 N
  • 1 Judge
Energy: 12
  • 4 DCE
  • 8 Lightning Energy
Open Slots: 4

Strategy:
The Strategy is to use Hoopa EX to bring out the Rayquaza EX line, set up sky field, fill up the bench and use Emerald break. Due to battle compressor being in expanded, one way to set up is to ultra ball discard a lightning energy and then using mega turbo. The float stone should be attached to the Hoopa EX because if Hoopa is brought out, it has no way to attack, which will result in a DCE discard. Jolteon and Zoroark are secondary attackers, and are there is Rayquaza gets KO'd.

GLHF :)
-Swampert Fan 101
 
Personally I think a 3-3 Mega Ray line is needed and I personally cut down a bit on the lightning energy maybe down to 6. Then add in one more Trainers' Mail as it would help with speed.
 
A few thoughts for your consideration:
  • Is the referenced Altaria suppose to be Altaria ROS 74 and not "XY 46"?
  • You may want to incorporate 1-2 Skyla in order to search and find needed Trainers (especially an Item or Stadium).
  • IMO, a 2-2 Zoroark line would be more helpful than the 1-1 Altaria line. Currently, your Zoroark and Altaria lines are just 1-1 which place you at risk of not getting both lines into play should any of the Pokémon be prized.
  • You may want to incorporate 1-2 Super Rod should your opponent ever play a Parallel City to reduce your bench size.
Suggested deck changes:
-1 Altaria
-1 Swablu

+1 Zoroark
+1 Zorua (Moonlight Madness)
+1 Skyla
+2 Puper Rod
+1 Clemont / Fisherman - to search and get Basic from your deck or discard pile​

I hope you find these comments helpful.
 
I was thinking the exact same as you, I've been playing a speed Ray deck for about a year now in expanded and did very well but always suffered against the obvious weaknesses. With most of them rotating out already drooling over the anticipation of what a Standard Ray deck could do. I'll show you my perspective list and we can see what differs and compare opinions.

Pokemon (16)
  • 3 Rayquaza Ex
  • 3 M Rayquaza Ex
  • 2 Shaymin Ex
  • 2 Hoopa Ex
  • 2 pikachu
  • 2 raichu (circle circuit)
  • 1 Zorua (madness)
  • 1 Zoroark (mind jack)
Trainers (32)
  • 3 Mega Turbo
  • 4 trainers mail
  • 3 ultra ball
  • 4 vs seeker
  • 1 hex maniac
  • 2 lysandre
  • 1 N
  • 1 pokemon fan club
  • 2 sycamore
  • 2 shuana
  • 1 skyla
  • 4 sky fields
  • 1 float stone
  • 3 rayquaza spirit link
Energy (12)
  • 8 lightening
  • 4 DCE

I like your idea for the Jolteons but I still worry about things locking EX attackers down, which is why I was thinking of running things like Pika line to have a back up attack to Ray that is not an EX or a basic that can take care of those kinda threats and has free retreat. Zoro is really not even there as an attacker, although he could be, but moreso for a keldeo replacement with float stone, though it may not even be necessary since pikas can retreat for free, the only real threat there is the hoopas, and not sure it is even worth it for that. I'm considering maybe trying for puzzles of times as well? Also wondering trainers mail vs random receiver? Thoughts?
 
Goldinguy said:
I was thinking the exact same as you, I've been playing a speed Ray deck for about a year now in expanded and did very well but always suffered against the obvious weaknesses. With most of them rotating out already drooling over the anticipation of what a Standard Ray deck could do. I'll show you my perspective list and we can see what differs and compare opinions.

Pokemon (16)
  • 3 Rayquaza Ex
  • 3 M Rayquaza Ex
  • 2 Shaymin Ex
  • 2 Hoopa Ex
  • 2 pikachu
  • 2 raichu (circle circuit)
  • 1 Zorua (madness)
  • 1 Zoroark (mind jack)
Trainers (32)
  • 3 Mega Turbo
  • 4 trainers mail
  • 3 ultra ball
  • 4 vs seeker
  • 1 hex maniac
  • 2 lysandre
  • 1 N
  • 1 pokemon fan club
  • 2 sycamore
  • 2 shuana
  • 1 skyla
  • 4 sky fields
  • 1 float stone
  • 3 rayquaza spirit link
Energy (12)
  • 8 lightening
  • 4 DCE

I like your idea for the Jolteons but I still worry about things locking EX attackers down, which is why I was thinking of running things like Pika line to have a back up attack to Ray that is not an EX or a basic that can take care of those kinda threats and has free retreat. Zoro is really not even there as an attacker, although he could be, but moreso for a keldeo replacement with float stone, though it may not even be necessary since pikas can retreat for free, the only real threat there is the hoopas, and not sure it is even worth it for that. I'm considering maybe trying for puzzles of times as well? Also wondering trainers mail vs random receiver? Thoughts?
Click to expand...
Thanks for the advice , just one (nooby) question, is the madness Zorua needed? Except for the first attack, there does not seem to be any difference between this and the whiny voice Zorua.
 
If you're going to run Mega Turbos, I highly recommend maxing out Ultra Balls and Professor Sycamores to give you a better chance of having energy in the discard pile. Now, that being said, if you're only running 2 Mega Turbo's, your chances of hitting one or 1 being prized really kills that play. I wouldn't worry about M Ray's weakness with M Man rotating. Sure Jolteon is a thing, but that's only 140 dmg and you can still attack it next turn for a OHKO. I personally like the Jolteon EX line in with Mega Ray. ESPECIALLY with NinjaBoy. That setup just makes it so much easier to setup a M Ray or Jolteon. I know I know, NinjaBoy only gets out basics, but you can evolve M Ray that turn, so it works perfect in this deck. 1-1 line of Zoroak is meh, because your chances of hitting that and getting the DCE is very slim and it's not really a good play here unless you're running a 2-2 line, but meh...

  • 3 Rayquaza Ex
  • 3 M Rayquaza Ex
  • 2 Shaymin Ex
  • 2 Hoopa Ex
  • 2 pikachu
  • 2 raichu (circle circuit)
  • 2 Jolteon EX

Your energy line is good, I wouldn't change a thing there, but Trainers need a bit of adjusting.

  • 4 Professor Sycamore
  • 2 Lysandre
  • 1 Winona
  • 4 Ultra Ball
  • 4 VS Seeker
  • 3 Trainers' Mail
  • 1 Pokemon Fan Club
  • 2 Float Stone
  • 3 Sky Field
  • 3 Mega Turbo
  • 3 Rayquaza Sprit Link
  • 2 N
  • 1 Judge

You can drop the trainers' mail line all together and add another turbo, skyfield and skyla, or keep it. I dont see the need for judge with N. At least 3 Links to ensure you can evolve T1/2. Winona is no longer needed with no Altraia line.
 
Swampert Fan 101 said:
Thanks for the advice , just one (nooby) question, is the madness Zorua needed? Except for the first attack, there does not seem to be any difference between this and the whiny voice Zorua.
Click to expand...
I really like the idea of confusing the Defending Pokémon, because it now places your Zorua's subsequent, potential KO on a coin flip. Even if your opponent does manage to get the requisite "heads," that Defending Pokémon is still Confused and your next attacker may be able to get a few "extra" attacks in before a response KO. The Confusion status does provide an "edge." I only play the Moonlight Madness Zorua for that reason.
 
TuxedoBlack said:
I really like the idea of confusing the Defending Pokémon, because it now places your Zorua's subsequent, potential KO on a coin flip. Even if your opponent does manage to get the requisite "heads," that Defending Pokémon is still Confused and your next attacker may be able to get a few "extra" attacks in before a response KO. The Confusion status does provide an "edge." I only play the Moonlight Madness Zorua for that reason.
Click to expand...
Thanks, however I asked that question since Goldinguy's deck uses lightning energy and Zorua requires darkness energy for Moonless Madness.
 
Yea, it doesn't matter much since i don't run darkness. I've actually evolved my deck a bit since that post and it doesn't even use Zoro anymore since Raichu's have free treat and I have two stones to cover the hoopas. I've been testing Lugia EXes for attackers since I don't have the Jolt's and they are super hard to trade/buy right now. I don't think they are super necessary either since they're aren't many killer basics to worry about other than the nicety of stopping EXes. I also have problems running Sycamore, because it seems I'll have too many valuable pieces I can't play and don't want to lose while searching for one card I do and end up with Rays or Megas in the discard just because I was searching for a sky field or a DCE.
 
Yea, I've been doing lots of testing recently and I've experimented without Hoopas and using Winnoa instead, one hoopa, two hoopa, two floats, no floats... its been interesting to say the least. After seeing Pokemon Ranger released, Jolts seem even more shaky then I thought they might be before, but they are still decent attackers, and they still fit the lightening theme of the deck. I'm also worried with that Zebra thing that seems to be made specifically to kill Rayquaza. The deck may not be QUITE as dominate when standard flips as I thought it might be, but still most testing needed.

MOST RECENT LIST

Pokemon (17)
  • 3 Rayquaza Ex
  • 3 M Rayquaza Ex
  • 3 Shaymin Ex
  • 2 Jolteon Ex
  • 2 pikachu
  • 2 raichu (circle circuit)
  • 2 Hoopa Ex
Trainers (31)
  • 3 Mega Turbo
  • 1 sacred ash
  • 3 ultra ball
  • 4 vs seeker
  • 1 AZ
  • 1 hex maniac
  • 2 lysandre
  • 1 N
  • 1 pokemon fan club
  • 3 sycamore
  • 1 skyla
  • 1 winona
  • 4 sky fields
  • 2 float stone
  • 3 rayquaza spirit link
Energy (12)
  • 8 lightening
  • 4 DCE
 
Water based rayquaza decks will be allot better sense the meta is gonna shift from annoying night march decks and have more focus on EX decks and evolution's. plus Ninja boy is so good in this deck it should be automatic in every deck sense AZ is out anyway
 
What exactly does water bring to the RayQ deck, other than maybe using Manaphy for free retreats with water energy other than using float stones and AZ. Why do you think Water Ray will be the new thing? Also, why is Ninja boy auto include. I can see the benefit of no wasted energy if your not using a Ray as your first pokemon, but that never seems to happen very often for me. I think Ranger will actually be more useful for shutting down stuff like Girantina or any other annoying attack effects that might try to slow us down. Thanks for mentioning AZ would rotate out, I guess in all the switching in and out during testing I forgot to check if AZ was going to be legal.
 
When using Rayquazza with water energy you can utilize great attackers such as regice and glaceon ex to shut opponents attacks down. Sure theres pokemon ranger but you can't always be under the assumption your opponent is going to have it especially sense the battle compressor/vs seeker combo is gone. Manaphy is also a usefull addition as it helps everything with water energy have free retreat if for instance you dont have a float stone on Hoopa ex and they lysander it up you can simply retreat it with a water energy. Lastly in a deck that uses 4 shaymins and 2 Hoopas Ninja boy is important for fixing those horribly debilitating hoopa starts. plus in the event that you charge up a regice only for your opponent to start using an evolution you can ninja boy to a glaceon ex. Plus Hoopa For Shaymin, Rayquazza, and manaphy then ninja boy hoopa for glaceon and then useing that same hoopa for Mega Rayquazza, Shaymin and Rayquazza is a great set up combo
 
Goldinguy said:
1 sacred ash
Click to expand...
Don't forget that this will be rotated out so I suggest Super Rod! :)

I'm currently running only 4 energy but I still have battle compressor in my deck. I think post-rotation, I may crank it up to only about 5-6 lightning energy. How's 8 working? Also, use 4 ultra balls so in case you don't have Hoopa EX at the start, you can always search for it.
 
I like 8, its been my magic number, maybe even on the excessive side by it makes for easy things to discard and I like em being in the discard pile, at least a few for mega turbos. I suppose I can see the ninja boy for hoopa starts, though I never have had too much a problem, I generally get a stone fast enough if it happens, and if a shaymin, I just use the one energy retreat as a way to get a energy in the pile for turbo. I'd be interested to see a water list if you have one Jackle, the combo of running Regice and Glaceon is interesting to lock down a bunch of different attackers
 
Hello again. How is the Mega Ray deck working out for you so far in this new format? I am rather curious how can we catch up with parallel city alongside darkrai / giratina decks. Thanks for your response.
 
I've been getting busted. Both the reasons you mentioned. Parallel city is just devastating and most all decks play it now. Giratina is a bad match up also though sometimes I can speed through it or lyasander around it but once they get the parallel city up and lock it in its game over usually for me. I hope someone has suggestions because I've tried all sorts of variations of Ray decks but right now it just seems like there are other better choices out there for top tier
 
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