DLVM Singleton

fleshrum

fleshrum

Cephalophore
Member
DLVM: Where Maintenance Isn't So Bad​
(jk it still stinkz lol)​
A friend and I were discussing alternative formats. Other games (and one in particular) seem to have an abundance of them. We play two-handed LotR LCG, Multiplayer Star Wars LCG, Netrunner constructed and draft, Magic: the Gathering draft... but the crowning achievement is without a doubt the alternative Magic format Elder Dragon Highlander, for three main reasons:
1. the rules of the game are not changed to unrecognizable degree. Aside from changing the quantities of cards and life, the only rule addition is the command zone and general, which subtly complicate the gameplay without changing the mechanics.
2. the changes complicate deckbuilding strategies. Having only 1 copy of each card prevents min-maxing. Having a general forces you to make deck decisions you wouldn't normally make.
3. games incorporate luck and skill. Multiple copies of cards can turn the game into one decided by commitment (monetary or otherwise) rather than how you use the cards you are dealt. It evens the playing field without homogenizing the game.
All we could find for Pokémon was the Half Deck format (which is excellent, but underrepresented and not as interesting as what we had in mind) and "Singleton 150" which is not actually a singleton format.
So we set out to create a new format with these elements in mind, and DLVM was born.

The Rules​
Deck Creation. Players construct 54 card decks. They may include up to one copy of each card by name and any number of basic energy. Decks may not include basic Pokémon.
Team Creation. The remaining six cards must be basic Pokémon in any combination.

Game Setup​
Decide which Pokémon from the Team shall lead and place it face down as your active Pokémon. Place the rest face down on the bench. Both players reveal their cards at the same time. Draw seven cards and mulligan as needed. No prizes are drawn.
The Pokémon with fewer colourless symbols in their retreat cost goes first.
Gameplay proceeds as normal.

Banned & Errata'd List​
All casual formats are best moderated by the people who play them, so an official banlist/errata/FAQ thing shouldn't really exist. The only exception is when the mechanics of the card subvert the game's basic premise. As such:
Fossil Researcher is banned.
N (Noble Victories 92) instead reads "Each player shuffles his or her hand into his or her deck. Then, each player draws a card for each Pokémon their opponent has in play." [loads of credit to user Blah for this idea!]

Some Rationale​
* This game is designed to mimic in-game 6v6 play by having a predetermined roster and supporting it with items and energy.
* Pokemon being in play from turn 1 complicates deckbuilding strategies, but the gameplay remains the same.
* 100 cards is too many considering our collection size, but highlander formats are traditionally 100 cards... only time will tell if we have the gall to increase deck size.
* Currently debating actually decreasing decksize to singleton 30. Not sure how this will impact the game. Will test.
* No prizes because they would significantly disrupt the singleton nature of the format. EXs can and do hold considerable sway, but that's okay.
* Fossil Researcher is banned because it allows you to tutor for two additional necessary KOs (Amaura and Tyrunt being nonbasics). It would be an auto include in every deck, lengthen games and negatively affect the 'spirit of the game.'
* My collection is entirely XY-onwards, while my friend's is BW-onwards. BW seems like a safe place to start since the card templating and rules sets have not rotated since then. But, again, this is casual, so use sets as far back as you like. I do think it would be helpful to limit them based on templating though, to prevent confusion.
* This was initially multiplayer. That didn't end well. Kudos if you have an idea on how to make it so, please share.

*​
There you have it. I don't know if there is a market for this sort of thing, but I figured the premier Pokémon forum would be a good place to start.
I will be updating this post with a decklist and maybe more rationale or something else if there is interest.
Thanks for reading!
 
Have you tested this format a lot? This sounds like a cool and fun alternate way to play, but I'm concerned about a couple things (although this is coming from someone who obviously has not tested this format at all yet, so these may prove to be non-issues):

1. The format is going to revolve around a couple gigantic powerful EX's with little room for creativity outside of it. Due to there being no prizes, playing something other than an EX is generally a disadvantage. Considering it's a singleton format, the lack of Catcher effects might make some evolutions more playable, but I'm not sure.

2. Consistency is going to be a major issue due to the large decks and limited supporters (54 cards is large when you can only run 1 of each supporter). I'm worried that games will come down to who hits their 1 Sycamore first and can start fishing through their deck for stuff.

3. As a small thing, you should make some kind of official ruling on N lol. Both players shuffle and draw 6 always wouldn't seem like a bad idea (or something of the sort).

Again, I've played a grand total of 0 games in this format, so I have no idea if #1 and #2 are actually issues, but I thought I'd mention them in case you have any ideas for solutions (if they do end up being problems).


Edit: Oh, and I think Lysandre's Trump Card should be banned since it + VS Seeker sorta ruins the point of the format. Same goes for other cards that can get Pokémon out of your discard.
 
Hey, thanks for the reply. Hopefully your interest is piqued enough to actually try it at some point.
I've been playing three EXs and three non-EXs, two of which cap at stage 1. In my case, Xerneas is essential to accelerating into big basic EXs, while Littleo is an excellent defence mechanism against the same. Swellow keeps them at bay. Usually at least one is evolved by turn ~2. They rarely get sniped. I'm playing against a deck and pilot of about the same level. It is impossible to say for sure without more decks, more opponents, more testing. Would limiting the EX count help maybe? One EX (just like the online mega rule) seems fairly grokkable... What do you think?
The consistency thing is true though. Just finished a few games with 30 cards + no mill out rule. Much more consistent, but the energy counts seem off. Maybe 40? Will test.
Good call on N. OP updated.
And the Timetwister effect is symmetrical, which usually helps balance things. I don't have one yet. I'll have to test it out. Wouldn't it make more sense to ban VS Seeker since it does lead to some pretty mean interactions? [EDIT: I get it now, all of your KO'd 'mons would then be in the deck, and the other supporter could be Fan Club or something to cheat them into play. While I won't flat out ban it until I get some more replies, doing so seems like a safe plan.]
All great suggestions, thank you very much Blah!
 
Er, so gonna revive this thread to add a couple things to what I said earlier.

1. 40 card decks seem like a good idea, 30 might be even better. Both would have to be tested--but I think 60 (54 essentially) is definitely far too many.

2. One EX sounds significantly better than letting them run rampant in the format. I'm still sorta concerned about how much hold big basics in general will have, so you might even consider neutering basics entirely and forcing the play of evolutions like "basics can't attack" or something.

3. Cards that can get Pokémon out of the discard should definitely be banned. They would completely ruin the idea and concept of the format--and most games would turn into an extremely long, luck-based battle of who can get more Pokémon in play over the course of the game.

4. That idea for N is good, but you should make it however many Pokémon your opponent has in play. That way, the card becomes weaker as you kill things, rather than it becoming weaker as your opponent kills things. Seems far more balanced this way.
 
I really like the idea of a format like this. Of course, I haven't tested it yet, so I'm not sure how smoothly it would work. However, I do have some input on certain things. Most of these are ideas that were already stated, but I figured I'd at least share what I felt about them.

1. I think that 40 cards is a decent number. 60 seems too large, while 30 seems too few.

2. The limitation of one EX seems like a good idea. This prevents them from running the format as Blah stated, and also allows for more stage 1 and 2 Pokémon to shine.

3. Lysandre's Last Resort and other cards that get Pokémon out of the discard should be banned. However, Last Resort could receive an errata in which you shuffle all cards excluding Pokémon into your deck.

Other than that, I personally think that it could work very well. However, I haven't played any games in this format, so I'm not entirely sure. I'll get to working on some decks and test it out with the different rulings to see how they affect the game. Also, I have some ideas for a multiplayer version, but I think it would be better to establish firm rules for a standard 1 v 1 first.
 
I love the idea of alternative formats, and I'm surprised I hadn't thought of a mechanic like this before myself. I've been a long time lurker here, but wanted to add some my own input for once ;)

Why not add a rule that when a Pokémon is knocked out it is instead sent to the lost zone or just flat out removed from play altogether? This could allow cards that work with the discard still be playable, and also lessen the blow of having to discard a higher stage Pokémon due to the effects of another card such as Prof. Juniper.

I agree with BugPokemonMaster316 in limiting the use of EX Pokémon, or at the very least going the Unilimted 150 route and placing the limit instead on total HP counts as I find that is where the real trouble lies.
 
Thanks for the input, glad to see some interest! Sorry for the absence.
Has anyone done any testing so far?
Also, bugmaster, please help me make Multiplayer work.
EDIT: We use leftovers so EXs don't dominate since most of them are in 'real' decks. I suppose an HP limit is fine, but its also kind of arbitrary, like creating tiers in-game divided by base stat total. Slaking doesn't deserve it.
 
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