I honestly have no idea about who is scummy or not, as most of the posts are confusing to me, but I see neutral ATM for everyone.
Only issue (partially), is, why does whoever knowing Celever has a vote weight of 3 care so much, i think it was jade so @Jadethepokemontrainer
Probably just a gesture to scum saying "yall need to group together more," although we should still take this seriously
Reads:
bb- Scum for above reason (too leading)
sm- Leaning towards scum due to reasons the rest of you stated
Cel- neutral with the tiniest bit scum due to potential slip
As by the next time I will be online on the actual site, the day would be over, I am just going to vote for the person highest on my scum reads from my initial analysis. ##VOTE: bbninjas
Not much of my read on him has changed, so i stuck with him at the top.
Mirdo, I will answer your question Day 2 (elaborate).
Celever never gets a serious threat from him, even in the reads part it's just neutral for the sake of covering all bases, but here, when Celever is almost sure to be lynched, he makes sure to vote another person to appear town after Celever's possible town flip.
I think everything that you posted there regarding TSM is logical and makes sense. You didn't say much about him not appearing for ages, though, despite being on Discord, and I think that's a very notable thing. It reminds me a lot about how rainy acted a scum in Pirates.
I've been hesitant on a TSM lynch because of the likelihood of them being subbed out, since half of my vote would have been an inactivity vote, however the likelihood of that happening is going down. I had forgotten about Cypher. I actually didn't realise how contradictory TSM was, so he's shot up as a scum read for me.
I'm still in the middle of writing another post, jsyk.
I think everything that you posted there regarding TSM is logical and makes sense. You didn't say much about him not appearing for ages, though, despite being on Discord, and I think that's a very notable thing. It reminds me a lot about how rainy acted a scum in Pirates.
I've been hesitant on a TSM lynch because of the likelihood of them being subbed out, since half of my vote would have been an inactivity vote, however the likelihood of that happening is going down. I had forgotten about Cypher. I actually didn't realise how contradictory TSM was, so he's shot up as a scum read for me.
Worth considering, while taking notice at the vote count, we don't want to make a counting mistake. Also worth mentioning that I still haven't got an answer from @rainyman123 about what he thinks of the point I made:
Was gonna vote Cypher, but clicked his profile and noticed that he's not lurking or anything, he's just not here at all, since Friday. Jade, while seeming scummy to me, looks as though he's at least trying his best, and TSM hasn't really answered any questions on him yet and he is my top scum read. Jesi is also appaearing slightly scummy, Might be a scum buddy with LC. Not quoting anything as I gotta leave for my next class (I ride the bus between my 1st and 2nd period classes) in like a minute.
Also, don't you think it's a bit pointless to vote TSM now that we see he's probably going to be subbed out, due to him not playing at all for a long time and after being called out multiple times?
You say that you remember how he plays as town, but you can't give any evidence whatsoever for it? Then what are you remembering, and what did you base your conclusion "I think Celever does the things that I have pointed out, but to a lesser extent, as town" on?
No, I meant that the post that I was referring to was when I pointed out the scummyness in Celever's push against morda.
Really? First off, I'm pretty sure Celever didn't push for morda, and the closest thing I can find is you saying that Celever wanting people to guess his thoughts is "bad play".
In fact, here's every single post of yours before you suddenly popped in and got the Celever wagon going. I am still yet to see where you showed up during scattered's pressure, as you said here.
I got home a bit late yesterday, so didn't have time to read through the thread. I'll try to pick my activity up, most of the things I've been busy with lately should be done with after this weekend, so I hope to have more time available from day 2 on.
@PikaMasterJesi I asked you earlier if you thought Little Cherrim's vote was simply a rookie mistake or if he should have known better. I don't think you ever responded to my question, any reason why you didn't?
Regarding the Celever business, his play style these last pages is reminding me soo much of how he was playing in Order in the Court... I don't recall him acting like this under pressure in any of the games where he was town.
The most likely thing I can think of is because he listed the three most experienced players as his scum reads, but I don't necessarily think that's scummy. There's also what you were hinting at with how he phrased it "I'm sure of it", but that's reaching even harder than I tend to do v.v
I do not think morda is scummy for thinking at least one of you three is scum, and having me guess your reason for thinking someone is scummy is just bad play.
I am standing behind the lynch- it is the best option so far. Pretty much the only reason I am having serious second thoughts is the 3 VW point. And I hate to base today's lynch on hosting reading. The other point about Celever being the same in other games is totally subjective.
I don't think it's subjective to say that Celever OMGUSes, is sarcastic, and the like as town and as scum. It is fairly subjective to compare the extent of which Celever does these things as town and scum, however, unless there's evidence given and analysed.
So is the opposite, but what is not subjective is that he has kept a low profile, and is not contributing like normal. The fact that he did not attempt to defend himself or offer an alternative is also weird.
I think he did give a reason for his lower profile - exams - but I can't seem to find that post anymore. He did make a comment about exams, but didn't directly attribute his lower activity to it. Never mind, he did here. I do find it quite odd that you say that he didn't offer an alternative, since you actually say something here about Celever and exams:
But oh well, that doesn't matter anymore, I think I got the picture of Celever just being overwhelmed by the exams he had, so I am not going to try to analyze this weird thing and just wait for him to shape up.
Reading this a few times, I'm actually not fully understanding what you were getting at here, so could you explain please?
I just said that after all - as a general rule- a case cannot be perfect-especially during D1, so we can't throw it away just because one point that doesn't match perfectly (like the 3 VW).
Yeah, that's fair. I'm not actually trying to say that the case isn't perfect, but rather I think that the most of the points are moot, especially as (from what I can gather) the majority of the case is based on meta tells that I deem inaccurate. I definitely think that there are much better lynches than Celever.
Possible Current Vote Count
Celever (5): b, sscattered mind (131-), rainyman123 (203-) Simsands Jesi Lord
Lord o da rings (3): Celever
bbninjas (2): Epist TSM
TheSceptileMaster (0):
Simsands (2) - GM Drac bbninjas
I think that unless another player shows up, you and me can't really affect the results..
I think he did give a reason for his lower profile - exams - but I can't seem to find that post anymore. He did make a comment about exams, but didn't directly attribute his lower activity to it. Never mind, he did here. I do find it quite odd that you say that he didn't offer an alternative, since you actually say something here about Celever and exams:
Reading this a few times, I'm actually not fully understanding what you were getting at here, so could you explain please?
-By providing an alternative- I am referring to Celever not giving an alternative for the lynch (he voted Lord again because OMGUS).
-What I meant about him gone under the radar is saying how he is not contributing- I know that this can be because of the exams. But it's still a possible legit way out of scums being blamed for doing that to give their IRL issues to defend themselves. It is not a fact that he did that on purpose, it is a fact that he flied under the radar- in the general term of not being active as usual, regardless of it being actively or passively done. Hoped I made more sense.
The above points btw are unrelated to each other as it seems to me you got them confused maybe? That's how I read it. Those points are unrelated and also refer to two different points during the game. The first one refers to mid day, and the other to late day (his last post)
That's a good point. I've got my suspicions to why he didn't give an alternative lynch option, but I'm not going to put words in his mouth, especially if he is scum and if I've just given him a way out or something.
-What I meant about him gone under the radar is saying how he is not contributing- I know that this can be because of the exams. But it's still a possible legit way out of scums being blamed for doing that to give their IRL issues to defend themselves. It is not a fact that he did that on purpose, it is a fact that he flied under the radar- in the general term of not being active as usual, regardless of it being actively or passively done. Hoped I made more sense.
The above points btw are unrelated to each other as it seems to me you got them confused maybe? That's how I read it. Those points are unrelated and also refer to two different points during the game. The first one refers to mid day, and the other to late day (his last post)
I see what you mean. Scum can be like "Ohey, I've got exams, so I'll use that as an excuse not to contribute", sure. I'm just not too sure if scum Celever would gain too much out of it. He'd be letting people like myself and you do most of the pressure (since atm we seem to be the only ones doing that), and if he was scum, he'd risk us pushing a lynch on a scumbuddy without him being able to influence it very much, which he otherwise could have. Honestly, this is a little WIFOMy, which is why I - with all things considered - give Celever the benefit of the doubt here that he's telling the truth, and so again I don't think it's a strong point for his lynch. Also, I think that he's had less activity across the board generally.
Alright, I will be here to the very end probably, so I am ready to unvote and vote for a better option (TSM? are we agree on that?) once someone else show up to back us up so we can actually do it.
Good morning. Im Not American but Germany has a Holiday so im Waking up late ^^.
I Read through Everything And Good Job on writing Two Pages worth of Posts while i slept.
I think i have to agree with BB and ##Vote:Simsands
Mostly because of bbninjas posts and GMDraclords #268
I Read through that and have to agree. I just get some scummy vibes from Sim. And everyone who is needlessly pushing tue (at this point) Pretty much empty case against celever even After Many Posts from diffrent People Why thats Not a Good idea.
Send from my Mobile. Excuse the random capatilization. Autocorrect is annoying
TSM was almost non-existence right after Cypher it hard to really comment about him. But for now I'm still more suspicious of simsands. Unless simsands can give me a better reason vote someone else.
I think bb raised good points on simsands. I'm not sure exactly how good, but I know I'm town and I don't know the same about simsands. ##VOTE: simsands
Also, ngl, because this saves me. And if the timing is convenient, my maths exam just finished. Based on how it went, this could quite possibly hammer me. IDK how maths works.
