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Standard New Format's Shurikens

Calcab

Calcab

Aspiring Trainer
Member
Pokémon: 17
  • 4 Talonflame STS
  • 3 Greninja BREAK BKP
  • 3 Froakie BKP
  • 4 Frogadier BKP
  • 4 Greninja BKP
Trainers/Supporters/Stadiums: 35

  • 1 Wally
  • 1 Skyla
  • 1 Fisherman
  • 3 N
  • 2 Lysandre
  • 4 Professor Sycamore
  • 1 Pokémon Ranger
  • 4 VS Seeker
  • 2 Level Ball
  • 4 Dive Ball
  • 2 Super Rod
  • 4 Bursting Balloon
  • 3 Rough Seas
Energy: 8
  • 8 Water Energy
  • 2 Splash Energy
Strategy:

I'm going with the Talonflame/Greninja thing because I think Talonflame adds so much consistency on this deck that it worths the 3 dead cards when I open with Talonflame (or even the 4 when I don't). The other Pokémon is basically the core of the deck. I'm no running Octillery and I don't plan to use it because I don't think it's so great now, because I won't need draw power since I can search whatever I want in the early game and because it'll also be hurt by Garbodor.

About the high count of N + Sycamore: Considering I'll need some extra consistency and those cards are great both early and late game, I don't think it'll be a problem. 2 Lysandre because we don't have Battle compressor anymore to get it so easy as we did before.

I'm going with 4 Balloons because many Greninja decks are running those because we don't have XY Greninja or Muscle Band anymore, and when I tested I felt it went so great on this deck that I can't play without them anymore. In fact, Bursting Ballon got me many wins or at least time to set up.

Well, I think the rest of this deck is the core of Greninja and I'd like some suggestions.

BTW, I apologize for any English mistake, English's not my first language. :p
 
Not only will you miss battle compressor but also VS seeker as well. In the 2017 standard format VS seeker is a secret rare.
 
I'm not an expert, and I see what you are saying octillery being shut down if Garbodor comes into play, but so is greninja break. Shouldn't you take your chances for the extra draw power to try and get those extra energy a to make greninja break more useful? IMO if you can use greninja's ability you can use octillery's.
 
Greninja BREAK almost always wins if you go second and get a first turn water dups. I run three Wally so I can hit it half the time. Wally is also not bad late game allowing you to go from a Frogadier to Greninja BREAK out of nowhere. They also let the frogs come faster, since the entire purpose of this deck is to get enough frogs your opponent can not knock them out fast enough. Dropping the 4th Froakie will make you start with Talonflame MORE than a Froakie. Also do not hesitate to keep Talonflame benched for a few turns.
 
Bournopolis said:
I'm not an expert, and I see what you are saying octillery being shut down if Garbodor comes into play, but so is greninja break. Shouldn't you take your chances for the extra draw power to try and get those extra energy a to make greninja break more useful? IMO if you can use greninja's ability you can use octillery's.
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Greninja is the deck core, Octillery isn't, that's why I prefer no to risk it with spot I could be using something more efficient. Also, I played with Octillery for a long time and I didn't find it so useful as it meant to be, and after my tests without it I didn't miss it, to be honest.

Dalton said:
Greninja BREAK almost always wins if you go second and get a first turn water dups. I run three Wally so I can hit it half the time. Wally is also not bad late game allowing you to go from a Frogadier to Greninja BREAK out of nowhere. They also let the frogs come faster, since the entire purpose of this deck is to get enough frogs your opponent can not knock them out fast enough. Dropping the 4th Froakie will make you start with Talonflame MORE than a Froakie. Also do not hesitate to keep Talonflame benched for a few turns.
Click to expand...
Agreed, but without Compressor + VS Seeker combo, getting Wally will be really complicated if I trust only my first draw (because to get a new hand I would use a support), so I prefer not to risk it and go to a more consistent thing that will work most of the time. I'm missing something here, why dropping the 4th Froakie would make me start with Talonflame more than a Froakie?

Anyways, thanks for the replies.
 
Calcab said:
Agreed, but without Compressor + VS Seeker combo, getting Wally will be really complicated if I trust only my first draw (because to get a new hand I would use a support), so I prefer not to risk it and go to a more consistent thing that will work most of the time. I'm missing something here, why dropping the 4th Froakie would make me start with Talonflame more than a Froakie?
Click to expand...

If I did my math right... (Bet I did'int)

Because having four froakies in your deck gives you a 28 out of 60 chance to draw a froakie, and a 28 chance out of 60 to get talonflame. Which is about 50/50.
Dropping a froakie gives you a chance to instead draw a froakie 21 out of 60, which DOES NOT, increase the chance to draw a talonflame, but increases the chance to mulligan, giving you another chance to draw talonflame.

I have run 4+ variants of greninja, and as I see it, unless you intend to use 3 or more rare candy's, you never need more then 3 froakies, They only end up as dead cards later.
 
I never compressor for Wally. You never play compressor unless you,run 3-4 talonflame. I have random receiver. I also have gotten turn two Greninja break by Wallying both turns. Wally is so good to go two stages a turn when you need to rebuild the army.
 
Border_Games said:
If I did my math right... (Bet I did'int)

Because having four froakies in your deck gives you a 28 out of 60 chance to draw a froakie, and a 28 chance out of 60 to get talonflame. Which is about 50/50.
Dropping a froakie gives you a chance to instead draw a froakie 21 out of 60, which DOES NOT, increase the chance to draw a talonflame, but increases the chance to mulligan, giving you another chance to draw talonflame.

I have run 4+ variants of greninja, and as I see it, unless you intend to use 3 or more rare candy's, you never need more then 3 froakies, They only end up as dead cards later.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I understand that. I'm using 3 Froakies already, so I thought he meant I should add a 4th Froakie. :p Thx.
Dalton said:
I never compressor for Wally. You never play compressor unless you,run 3-4 talonflame. I have random receiver. I also have gotten turn two Greninja break by Wallying both turns. Wally is so good to go two stages a turn when you need to rebuild the army.
Click to expand...
Oh, I'll probaly test it out with Random Receiver, turn 2 Frogardier is really very strong.
 
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